Ted Haggard to make a “Surprising” and “Groundbreaking” announcement next week…
- Posted on May 28, 2010
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Ted Haggard's publicist said today that the ousted founder of New Life Church will announce plans for his future at a press conference at his Colorado Springs home Wednesday morning. Haggard's spokesman said he would make a "surprising" and "groundbreaking" announcement with his family. Ted Haggard and his wife Gayle on April 29 incorporated a new church, St. James, sited at their home at 1865 Old Ranch Road. At the time, Ted Haggard said it was done for accounting purposes as the couple managed dual speaking careers. However, Haggard did tell the Colorado Springs Gazette that he likely would return to ministry one day and wouldn't rule out that St. James would one day be a real church.
On a personal note... I really wish Ted didn't have a publicist or any kind of groundbreaking or surprising announcements. A ground breaking announcement could be that is starting an 'official' new church. A surprising announcement could be that it would be an affirming church. I have no idea what the announcement will be; but my cynical side tells me that it will probably be neither groundbreaking nor surprising.
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John Burton on Tue, June 01, 2010
The point I was making is that I don’t sense the type of mercy and grace that Jesus has for Ted and Todd from people here.
Nobody wants them restored to leadership. They both have a huge, huge mandate, a ministry to fulfill… it’s a key reason they are on the Earth.
A failure simply cannot stop that mission permanently… we have to pray for them to find restoration so they can see people impacted wonderfully for Jesus.
I also hear people say that they don’t feel they are restored, and that they are sure to repeat their sins again? Huh? What type of God and what type of grace are you familiar with?
God can most certainly set people free permanently… often in less than a second!
Regarding 1 Tim 3, that’s a very important verse. I agree that we must be very much above approach. But, this is talking about a reputation that’s poor due to continued unresolved issues.
Do any of you know a pastor or leader that 100% of people think well of? No way. Plus, every pastor in the world has sinned. That doesn’t look good either.
But, as we respond to correction, to healing, to a restoration process, we can truly impact lives positively.
Look at Jim Bakker, for example… he came out of his terrible issues with amazing humility and he has quite a testimony. Many, many, MANY pastors and leaders have fallen, gone through a process, repented, etc… and have been much more effective on the back side.
John Burton on Tue, June 01, 2010
OH, and of course I’m not an emergent. Couldn’t be further from it.
Peter Hamm on Tue, June 01, 2010
John Burton writes “Regarding 1 Tim 3, that�s a very important verse. I agree that we must be very much above approach. But, this is talking about a reputation that�s poor due to continued unresolved issues.” You’ve decided it doesn’t mean Ted and Todd are unfit for ministry. I’m convinced it does.
Later,
Peter
CS on Tue, June 01, 2010
John:
“They both have a huge, huge mandate, a ministry to fulfill… it’s a key reason they are on the Earth.”
How do you know this? What if they are really being called to lives of quiet living and serving the Lord humbly? Or, what if they continue in apostasy?
“I also hear people say that they don’t feel they are restored, and that they are sure to repeat their sins again? Huh? What type of God and what type of grace are you familiar with?”
Do you understand the differentiation from forgiveness for sins and qualifications for leadership? And, in Bentley’s case, he has married the woman with whom he had an affair, so what does that say?
“Regarding 1 Tim 3, that’s a very important verse. I agree that we must be very much above approach. But, this is talking about a reputation that’s poor due to continued unresolved issues.”
Such as the unresolved issues of bailing on an elder-defined reconciliation path for Haggard, perhaps?
—
CS
CS on Thu, June 03, 2010
And so the news came out that he’s founding a new church. Essentially, in his press briefing he said, “I know what the Bible says, but I feel like God is leading me this way, anyway.” No shocker in this one.
Here’s the real question: Will New Life have the courage to tell its people to not go to Haggard’s church for biblical reasons? My bet is, “No,” because they’d rather not rock the boat and try to maintain the status quo, instead of proclaiming boldly that Haggard is wrong and should be avoided.
—
CS
John Burton on Thu, June 03, 2010
What if New Life or other Christians don’t believe he’s wrong? I’m sure there are a bunch of them that don’t.
My questions are:
Is Ted affirming the homosexual lifestyle?
If yes, then we do have a serious problem.
If no, then Tedd may have more courage than any of us.
Does Ted have a board of overseers, reputable authorities in his life?
If yes, then that’s great.
If not, then he may have some issues.
CS on Thu, June 03, 2010
John:
“What if New Life or other Christians don’t believe he’s wrong? I’m sure there are a bunch of them that don’t.”
It doesn’t matter how many people are in favor of him, it’s a matter of whether he qualifies for the biblical role of pastor or not. (Hint: he doesn’t.)
“Is Ted affirming the homosexual lifestyle?”
The more pertinent question is: Does Ted qualify as a pastor according to 1 Timothy and Titus?
“Does Ted have a board of overseers, reputable authorities in his life?”
He did, they told him to do something, he chose not to do it, and he went against their wishes.
—
CS
John Burton on Thu, June 03, 2010
In your opinion he doesn’t qualify for the biblical role of pastor. It takes humility to admit that others have different takes on it.
Ted did have overseers, and they released him at his request.
That’s in the past though… the question is, does he have coverage in the present.
Peter Hamm on Thu, June 03, 2010
John,
It sounds like you’re making excuses for him far more than delivering a solid biblical defense for his return to leadership and his spurning of the authority formerly in his life. He had oversight, decided he didn’t like it, and cast it off.
CS is absolutely right to say that he is NOT fit to pastor according to 1 Timothy 3. I only hope that people will have the common sense to realize this.
John Burton on Thu, June 03, 2010
I’m not making excuses whatsoever.
I simply see a huge difference between what someone was involved in previously vs. their current status.
This is basic gospel, and it’s saddening that you all aren’t seeing it.
Jesus shed his blood for Ted… and all of his past sins are fully cleared off and forgotten.
People mention that Todd Bentley isn’t fit for ministry because of his divorce. Yes, that’s a HUGE issue… or rather, WAS a huge issue… if he’s repented, then he’s on a clean slate and starting fresh.
The job now is to help them stay clean, stay accountable and stay on track. Since they were both susceptible to specific failures, it would make sense for them and their overseers to pay very close attention to them in those areas from here on out.
Of course, if Ted is affirming the gay lifestyle, then that changes everything. If Todd is affirming divorce, that changes everything.
Peter Hamm on Thu, June 03, 2010
John, I hate to shout but here goes. (I’m trying to stay respectful…)
NOBODY SAID THEY COULDN’T STILL FOLLOW JESUS! (Although, I’m not convinced Todd ever was, really…) You keep making this issue into something it’s not, and I think it’s to avoid the inevitable conclusion that neither of these men are fit for ministry… of ANY KIND!
You really and truly want to recommend that Christ-followers follow a man who left his wife and married his mistress and thinks that because he’s sorry now everything is cool?
You really and truly want to recommend that Christ-followers follow a man who when faced with a difficult road to travel by those who were in charge of his “restoration” (after confessing to en extra-marital homosexual affair and to pretty serious drug use), basically said, no thanks, I’m my own authority?
Do you really believe that repentance is really saying “I’m sorry”, and then the whole Christ-following world says “Oh, since you’re really sorry, I guess you can do whatever you want and lead wherever you want”, including marrying the mistress? Come on!
John, if you believe these things, I don’t know that we have anything else to discuss. I honestly believe that you are gravely and seriously mistaken about these things, and the only way you can show that it’s okay for these people to lead is by subverting Scripture. You obviously believe that 1 Timothy 3 should be ignored.
CS on Thu, June 03, 2010
John:
“In your opinion he doesn’t qualify for the biblical role of pastor. It takes humility to admit that others have different takes on it.”
My opinion is absolutely worthless here. What matters is what the Bible says a man must have to be a pastor.
“Ted did have overseers, and they released him at his request.”
No, that’s wrong. He left the restoration process, the elders called it incomplete, and they said he should not return to vocational ministry. Google, “Ted Haggard Restoration,” and check the link at the Denver Channel.
“Jesus shed his blood for Ted… and all of his past sins are fully cleared off and forgotten.”
Like Peter, I’m sorry that you seem to have an inability to differentiate for past sins covered by Jesus with repentance and faith, and qualifying for the role of pastor.
The onus is now upon you. Please answer this with a Yes or No: Does Haggard meet the qualifications for the role of pastor as indicated in 1 Timothy 3? If, “yes,” please prove it biblically.
—
CS
John Burton on Thu, June 03, 2010
I’m not referring to your personal opinion, I’m referring to your opinion on the scripture.
Surely you realize that different people can have different viewpoints on scripture? Different denominations have emerged because of this issue… they differ on scriptural points. It’s not enough to say, “Well, the Bible is the final authority, and my analysis is right and yours is wrong.” That’s unfair.
You are right that it matters what the Bible says… but, you didn’t address the reality that your take on the scripture in question may just in fact be different than what another’s might be.
Does Ted meet the qualifications? That’s the point of what I’m trying to say. Neither you nor I have that answer.
It’s not our place to have the answer. We don’t have enough info about the situation.
Plus, again, we differ on biblical interpretation. I’m asking the question, “does he have a good reputation post-repentance,” while you are asking, “is there anybody in the world that looks at Ted unfavorably?”
Again, for me, I don’t know if Ted’s restoration process has been sufficient… but, also, it’s not my battle… I’m not the one to determine his readiness.
People seem to have grace for the sinner to get saved and to have an amazing testimony as they grow into a leader. The ex-drug addict, murderer, etc. can be a pastor… but a pastor who falls into an addiction and emerges from it can’t be a pastor again? That doesn’t make sense.
Hal on Thu, June 03, 2010
This will draw boo and hiss from many who say I am not forgiving but he is starting a church within the shadow of a loyal group he lied to and cheated without any true public repentance. He is thumbing his nose at the former supporters. insulting all pastors who truly dedicate their lives to Christ and he is mocking God. God judges not me, but I surely do not understand those who are following him.
CS on Thu, June 03, 2010
John:
“Does Ted meet the qualifications? That’s the point of what I’m trying to say. Neither you nor I have that answer.”
Actually, I do have the answer. He does not qualify. 1 Timothy 3 says so.
“It’s not our place to have the answer. We don’t have enough info about the situation.”
We have enough information through what Haggard has shared publicly, what his former church said, and what the Bible says.
“Plus, again, we differ on biblical interpretation. I’m asking the question, “does he have a good reputation post-repentance,” while you are asking, “is there anybody in the world that looks at Ted unfavorably?””
I’ll answer your question: He does not have a good reputation post repentance. Therefore, he does not meet the qualifications for pastor. You can tell even when unrepentant sinners mock him in the news publicly after he announces that he’s opening a new church that his reputation is bad.
“The ex-drug addict, murderer, etc. can be a pastor… but a pastor who falls into an addiction and emerges from it can’t be a pastor again? That doesn’t make sense. “
Actually, it makes perfect sense. This way, the church does not come into question and the Gospel that is being preached in that local congregation is not tarnished. Otherwise, God would not have had Paul write that.
—
CS
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