Wanted: An Old Fashioned Church
- Posted on March 07, 2008
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- (45) comments
I don’t want to have my eardrums bashed in by the three kids in the “worship band” who can’t be bothered to bathe, shave, dress or comb their hair on Sunday morning. If it’s really all about the God that Scripture describes as ineffably holy, shouldn’t that be reflected in attitude and dress for those who serve in church music?
I don’t want a vampy “praise and worship” leader who is flaunting her wares at every male within view as she does her worship moves on “stage”. If we are to worship God in spirit and in truth, as Scripture tell us, than what’s all the flesh about? Can we no longer discern the difference?
I don’t want to see people in beach attire with their backsides peeping out of their shorts because they think that God isn’t worth their best efforts at dressing. “God doesn’t care about clothes, only man”, they say. But the real reason is that it’s just plain easier to cruise into church in jeans or whatever is still lying on the floor from the night before. Dressing up for worship of the Lord would cost them something, however little, and they don’t want to pay it.
I also don’t want to see all the variations on lovers’ back rubs where Chuck and Sue take turns massaging each other’s neck and shoulders during the sermon so everyone behind them is completely distracted. Behavior affects other people. Are Christians so self-absorbed that they never think about the people behind them trying to hear the message?
You can read more at SliceofLaodicea.com...
I’m looking for a good Christian church. I don’t want to sing songs off a wall, the same five notes, over and over and over and over again while I am lightheaded from standing so long. There’s a record of the hymns of God’s people that spans 2000 years. Why are we so arrogant as to think we don’t need those wonderful songs any longer? Have we gone through more suffering, more affliction, more pain for Jesus than those who wrote these enduring hymns? Does a semi-secular song writer in Nashville with a multi-million dollar music contract have more to say to us about God and the Christian life than the 17th-century hymn writer who lost four children and his wife during the 30 years War?
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bishopdave on Fri, March 07, 2008
“Does a semi-secular song writer in Nashville with a multi-million dollar music contract have more to say to us about God and the Christian life than the 17th-century hymn writer who lost four children and his wife during the 30 years War?”
Oh thanks Slice! Now my cappuchino has come out thorugh my nose! Yea, verily the more I read that sentence, I see some validity there. Remember kids, theologians used to be our songwriters.
Peter on Fri, March 07, 2008
Y’know, I was pretty content when Slice went silent for a while. While there’s some validity to these statements, how about if we go back to the period prior to Martin Luther when only “professional” singers were allowed? Better yet, let’s sing some of those songs from the early church. I’d love to hear them.
Yes, songs need to have theological depth and not just a catchy tune. However, you can sing those out of a hymnal or from a screen. The Gettys are even writing new Hymns now, harmony and all, with sound theology. And now all contemporary P&W;is completely void of theology. Ugh.
As for the quote above, I think it’s also safe to say that some 17th century hymn writer may have less to say than some person who has a multi-million contract. Just because it’s old doesn’t mean it’s good (and sometimes there’s a really good reason these hymns have been dropped).
I love music that praises God and have been blessed to be able to look more beyond style and concentrate on the theology.
I guess I’m glad that you keep us aware of what Slice is putting out, if only so we know what people see of those who call ourselves Christ followers.
Tom on Fri, March 07, 2008
The writer makes a couple good points, but I must add that the theologians who were writing at their time were writing songs that fit their culture. If our church is to speak into our culture I find it best to use music that fits today’s culture. Perhaps you do not have to change the lyrics which were written by the theologians of our past, but the music that goes along with those lyrics must change.
This is also true about the way people dress for church. Did Jesus dress up to go to the Temple? No, of course he didn’t he was poor. I swear people would condemn Jesus if he were to show up in our churches today. He’d look dirty and undesirable and would probably be chastising us for how “Temple-like” we’ve made our churches. We don’t like people like that in our churches.
I should also point out that the writer is quite upset about people being selfish and only caring about themselves in church. What is he/she doing in this very article? It starts out with “I’m looking for…” for crying out loud!! Well, maybe the person next to you in the pew is “looking for…” relevance, understandable music, preaching, etc.
Just some thoughts to add to the discussion.
Richard on Fri, March 07, 2008
Is this supposed to be satire? To quote Stewie from “Family Guy” - “That’s not funny.”
Leonard Lee on Fri, March 07, 2008
Yes there is one of those churches down the street from my house. The 23 people left are guarding the sanctity of the service have an application for you to fill out and a covenant to sign.
Peter on Fri, March 07, 2008
Richard: That’s just Slice - best summary I can think of is “angry Christian”, barely worth reading except to find something to be upset about.
Tom: Jesus wasn’t rich? But, what about all of the preachers who keep telling me that he was? I’m so confused. Should I ask for my money back now? (posted with a huge http://www.mondaymorninginsight.com/images/smileys/grin.gif )
Tom on Fri, March 07, 2008
Peter,
I know I couldn’t believe it when I discovered that fact as well. I guess I was wrong to think I’d be pulling in over $100K when I finish seminary.
CS on Fri, March 07, 2008
“I don’t want to sing songs off a wall, the same five notes, over and over and over and over again while I am lightheaded from standing so long.”
How about this: can we please stop the songs where we are singing to God like He is our girlfriend? You know, those songs where if you exchanged “Jesus” for “baby” or “my lover,” and the song would be fine for secular radio.
—
CS
Rob on Fri, March 07, 2008
I could read more….but why? It’s not worth the time to click the link…it’s not about her, me, or you…it’s all about Him. If people could get that, really get that, church would be a much different place for ALL of us.
(sigh….and we wonder why more and more young seekers turn away from the church, seeing absolutely no difference in how they are treated inside the sanctuary as they are on the street….)
(Stepping off my soapbox…)
Peter Hamm on Fri, March 07, 2008
CS writes [How about this: can we please stop the songs where we are singing to God like He is our girlfriend?] Holy cow, CS, we agree again! We better BOTH check our temperature…
The writer of this post shoots himself in the foot. [There’s a record of the hymns of God’s people that spans 2000 years. Why are we so arrogant as to think we don’t need those wonderful songs any longer? Have we gone through more suffering, more affliction, more pain for Jesus than those who wrote these enduring hymns?] THIS part is so true. I try and use great old hymns as often as I can, but I play them in today’s idiom, the way I suspect the hymn-writers would want.
But…
[Does a semi-secular song writer in Nashville with a multi-million dollar music contract have more to say to us about God and the Christian life than the 17th-century hymn writer who lost four children and his wife during the 30 years War?] Uh… please find me somebody who writes worship songs with a multi-million dollar music contract. That’s a fantasy. And yes, maybe these people today have something to say, in our time and in our idiom, that is more pressing to us, in our present reality, than someone who lost their family during the 30-years war.
Check out “Wholly Yours” by David Crowder for instance. GREAT theology, great message, and no “jesus is my boyfriend” anywhere near it.
CS on Fri, March 07, 2008
Peter:
“Uh… please find me somebody who writes worship songs with a multi-million dollar music contract. “
The author was alluding to songwriter Brad Paisley who recently made a song with Sara Evans called, “New Again.” It’s played a lot on country radio, and is supposed to be the interchange between Christ crucified on the cross and Mary, His mother. It ventures into that dangerous area of putting words into the mouths of people in the Bible where none are given.
Both of them get paid beaucoups bucks, too. And…
“The writer of this post shoots himself in the foot. “
I’m pretty sure that Ingrid would take offense at being called a man. =)
—
CS
Brian on Fri, March 07, 2008
I started reading and got angry. Then my anger turned to laughing as I realized this is one of the funniest, most ridiculous things I’ve ever read. After that, my anger which had turned to laughter, turned to sorrow. I truly feel sorry for believers who find nothing redeeming about new methods and new music, but simply cling to the past and believe it to be holier and more devout.
I’ve been a youth pastor for the last 12 years, ministering in three different churches and the one question I hear more than ever is: How do we keep teen from leaving our church after they graduate from High School?
I respond, “Preach the gospel. Be ready in season and out. Reprove, rebuke and admonish. But, do so the way the apostle Paul did…become all things to all people”. The message never changes. The methods do.
Peter Hamm on Fri, March 07, 2008
CS,
I think she was quoting somebody in the first part, which is the part noted above.
I find nothing wrong with the song “New Again.” Sorry.
The post is still very sad, for the reasons Brian states above.
Leonard Lee on Fri, March 07, 2008
If Just as I am was good enough for Paul and Silas then is it good enough for me.
2000 years… Silly revisionists, that trick is for Barna
CS on Fri, March 07, 2008
Peter:
“I think she was quoting somebody in the first part, which is the part noted above.”
She said in her post just below the signature, “There are many who crave the kind of church I have described in my letter.”
“I find nothing wrong with the song “New Again.” Sorry.”
In this case, I agree with you. I was more pointing out how there are country musicians who make attempts at bridging the gap into contemporary Christian music. But it is dangerous to make it a practice of putting thoughts, feelings, or words into people in the Bible when we don’t have them.
—
CS
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