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GARBC Shuns Cedarville University

Orginally published on Wednesday, July 05, 2006 at 1:36 PM
by Todd Rhoades

I grew up in the very conservative GARBC (General Association of Regular Baptist Churches). (I never understood why my 'regularity' had to be a part of the name of the group; but anyway, that's a whole other subject.) While I've been outside the GARBC (or 'garb' as we always called it), I've watched from a distance over the years. I attended the then GARBC approved Cedarville College (in beautiful Cedarville, OH). So I was intriqued by the recent voting by the GARBC to sever all ties with Cedarville (now) University over the issue of 'secondary separation'. It has many people in this circle up in arms. And the enemy that brought things to a head... well, it's the Southern Baptists!...

The GARBC historically has been a conservative group.  In a nutshell (and I’m sure people will correct me if I’m oversimplying here), ‘secondary separation’ means that the stand of the GARBC is that they will not ‘fellowship’ with any group who fellowships with anyone else that might not agree with the GARBC.  In this case, the Southern Baptist Convention is the bad guy.

You see, a while back the Ohio Southern Baptist Convention passed a resolution approving Cedarville University as a Southern Baptist approved school (meaning that they would promote Cedarville to their church’s prospective college students).

In the past, Cedarville has had a long association (formally and informally) with the GARBC.

Here’s the rub… according to the GARBC, the SBC has some moderate churches and theologians that they would not like to associate with.  And because of these moderates, Cedarville should not associate with them either.  That means that the bottom line is this:  Since the University is associating with the Southern Baptists (who have condoned some moderate members); we (the GARBC) cannot associate with them (Cedarville).

This is the historical view of the GARBC and secondary separation.  It’s why my church growing up did not associate with any other churches in the area (even the baptist ones).  It’s why we didn’t even play softball on the church softball league (because we couldn’t associate with someone who disagreed with us on any issue).  You can read a position paper on historical secondary separation by Robert Ketcham here

The GARBC has brought us a couple of key evangelical players in the past generation (namely David Jeremiah, pastor of Shadow Mountain Community Church in San Diego, CA; and Joseph Stowell III, past president of Moody Bible Institute.) Both of these men have broken ranks with the GARBC in recent years primarily because of this issue of secondary separation.

So now, this fellowship of churches is at a new crossroads.  Many of the younger pastors and leaders see that to be effective, changes must come; and many feel that the GARBC’s historical view of secondary separation is not all that biblical.  Others fight for historical reasons (and biblical ones) that the GARBC must not change in this area.  By the closeness of the vote (311-283) to sever ties with Cedarville, it looks like a really controversial split.

I appreciate the sound teaching that I received growing up in such a conservative movement.  It really gave me a grounding in scripture that I would not have received in many other circles.  But I also appreciate the grace I also now enjoy in my relationship with Christ; grace that many times seemed somewhat lacking in the GARBC, especially in this area of secondary separation.

The GARBC’s severing of ties with Cedarville is unfortunate.  Especially when judging an institution on whether or not they have a relationship with Southern Baptists; on what kind of music they allow; or who is speaking in chapel (because they once spoke at a conference where this other person spoke (and we all know that this person was a part of this or that).  Those are the types of things that have taken alot of GARBC time and effort of late.

FOR DISCUSSION: I know to some, this is of no interest (and frankly, I’m surprised you’re still reading).  But I’d like to hear from some of my GARBC, SBC, and Cedarville friends.  What do you think of this recent decision?  Will it strengthen or hurt the GARBC?  And what about Cedarville?  Will it lose much support from the recent decision, or will garb people (and pastors) continue to support the institution?


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 TRACKBACKS: (0) There are 41 Comments:

  • Posted by kent

    I am neither GARBC or SBC or have ever attended Cedarville. I am not exactly sure where the school is located other than Ohio. But I did serve in Western Michigan where the GARBC was strong, and I learned about secondary separation first hand. I have always consider the Covenant to be a fairly conservative denomination, so I was surprised that the local GARBC church would not join in services with us becasue I would eat breakfast with local ministerium. I eat breakfast with almost anyone. We had also had been involved with the local churches for Good Friday and Thanksgiving services. They had no problems with me but didn’t like the company I kept. Well that was fine, unfortunate but fine. What made life curious for me was when the pastor of the church who would not join us because my associations came and asked to use our copier because theirs was on the fritz. I am an agreeable sort and said sure. But the amusing thought has always stayed with me that I am not good enough to worship with but my functioning and free copier was theologically pure and blessedly available.  There is a lesson here but I am not quite sure what it is.

  • Posted by

    “Institutions” have a way of making themselves null and void in the very circles in which they think they are the center of.. Or put another way - in control of.

    Kent? Definitely a thought-provoking lesson.

    That’s all for the moment.....

  • Posted by

    I attend a church that’s a member of the SBC, but even so, I’m in no position to answer the questions posed, but would simply ask another question:  What does this recent decision do for the Kingdom of God? From my line of sight, not much, if anything.

  • Posted by

    Kent’s post is disturbing.  You mean they wouldn’t eat with you because of the “company you kept”?  I’m outside of the Baptist denom. altogether so perhaps not knowledgeable enough about the politics involved, but that’s ridiculous.  Have they read Luke 7 lately?  Aren’t they behaving just like the Pharisee who looked down his nose at Jesus for allowing the ‘sinful’ woman to worship Him?  I’m no ecumenicalist (is that a word?) and would not want to be in a service with a Muslim or gay bishop but I would have dinner with them - we’re called to reach the lost.  But these guys won’t even eat with a brother in Christ because they believe he’s keeping company with more liberal sorts.  Unbelievable!  Correct me if I misunderstood - please…

  • Posted by Leonard

    Having grown up in the GARBC and experienced the Secondary Separation on several occasions I am not surprised.  I too affirm my biblical upbringing and the love for scripture it produced in me but I am so glad to have broken free from that part of my history. 

    As for the question(s) about impact I would say it will do very little to alter the decline of the Garb.  Out here the Garb churches I am aware of are all shrinking at such a rapid pace that you can actually hear it on a quiet night.  What is sad is that this is not a reason to be concerned in the GARBC but a reason to pat a back and say, at least we are still pure.  The church I grew up in forbade going to the Billy Graham crusade because there were Methodist on stage.  It forbade most Christian music, even though we did squeak a Gaither Trio song in occasionally.  Here is the deal IMO.  When you are known more for what you are against than what you are for, you are in trouble.  The GARBC is in trouble.

    I think this will actually open up the enrollment of Cedarville because now it won’t just be known as a garb school.  One final thought, I am now on the list of people you cannot hang out with so if you are GARBC, I understand you not calling.  Even though my theology is the same, my understanding of grace ruined my chance to be one of the GARBC guys.

  • Posted by

    Oh my.

    Recently we visited Amish country and while there I read up a bit about their theology and religious practice, and the fact that they broke from the Mennonites over the issue of “shunning.” Has a familar ring to this post.

    While I couldn’t help but appreciate the commitment to simplicity and family and community, I also wondered what they did with the mandates in scripture, beginning really with the Abrahamic covenant, to be “in and not of” and to influence the world with the mercy and grace (and yes . . . righteous judgment) of the one true God.

    Maybe the GARBC should establish some colonies around the country, pull in the drawbridges and wait for Jesus to come back.

    Wendi

  • Posted by Jeff M. Miller

    I’m not from a GARBC background, but from a similar independent Baptist group. For the last few years, I’ve been on staff at an SBC church. I now have friends (former) and other leaders from that group who will not longer associate with me. So, I’m feeling the pain of Kent and others.

    I don’t get it either. What shame we are bringing to the cause of Christ.

    Now, the group I was once a part of is very slowly beginning to open its doors to people of like faith. I don’t know what the future holds for GARBC and Cedarville, but I can’t help but think that cooperation between believers is a good thing. I know we have our minute doctrinal differences, but with the Gospel of Jesus Christ as central to our faith, surely a mature Christian can overlook such things for the building of the Kingdom.

  • Posted by Kent

    To be honest the incident I told earlier wasn’t so much sad as it was annoying. There is a redemptive part of the story, another pastor of a GARBC church in another town became a good friend of mine ujtil I left the area years later.

  • Posted by Chuck M

    I am so glad Jesus wasn’t a secondary separationist otherwise we wouldn’t have had the book of the Matthew (Matt 9).

  • Posted by

    I’m sorry.  I know this is a serious issue.  I go to a SBC church.  But “secondary separation” from Southern Baptists in many parts of the US would require immigration!  When you get to the point the SBC is too liberal, I’d suggest you’re about to run out of folks to shun.  And what do you do then for kicks and giggles?

  • Posted by Tye Male

    (rant warning!) This is ridiculous. It is hard for me to believe that this is still going on in Christian circles. The world must look at this and laugh. Personally, we were asked to leave a GARB church in Ohio and now I think they did us a favor. I’m not sure I want to be “secondarily associated” with a church that associates with an association that practices secondary separation. HA!

    I recommend that if you don’t like Cedarville University then keep your mouth shut and don’t encourage your people to go there. If you are so immature that you have to resort to “secondary separation” to live a pure and holy life, then go live on an island somewhere (or get discipled in a good Bible church). I’m all for piercing the darkness with the light of Jesus Christ and secondary separation only stops this.

  • Posted by

    Having taught at another GARB school in the 1980s and having followed some of its recent history, my only comment is that the GARB has always needed its schools more than the schools have needed the GARB.  Cedarville will continue to thrive while the GARB may gradually become more irrelevant because it will become harder and harder for it to attract young men (has to be men) to its pulpits.  They shoot themselves in the foot with such a move.

  • Posted by Bart

    I’m not from a GARB church, but have friends and relatives there.  While I think they have taken this to an extreeme, there is some cause for concern.  As a pastor how do I participate in a community worship service when the Presbyterian pastor denies the virgin birth, diety of Christ, and the resurection?  The Catholic priest has told me that if you pray enough and more importantly give enough money tothe Catholic church you can get your dead loved one into heaven.  The Methodist minister just preached a sermon on how everyone get to heaven, Muslim, Hindu, New Age, we all worship the same God and we all go to heaven.  The Lutheran pastor tells me that because someone is baptised in the Lutheran church and goes thru the conformation classes they go to heaven.  These too are extreeme positions.  We do not worship the same God.  How much should I participate with these other pastors?

  • Posted by

    But Bart . . . your examples don’t work here.  The SBC has a very clear statement of faith to which all SBC pastors must adhere in order to be part of the SBC.  Included is the virgin birth, deity and bodily resurrection of Christ, and salvation by grace through faith as the only means to salvation. 

    Plus, I think it is important to distinguish what types of things we can and cannot participate with in partnership for the kingdom sake in our communities.  For example I WOULD be (and am) part of a community ministerial group that includes Mormons and Muslims if our purpose is to address social needs of our community (homelessness, illiteracy, teen pregnancy, etc.) I WOULD (and did) partner with people of all faiths in a local “faith-based community service day” where we gathered and spread out in the community to paint out graffiti and clean up school yards and classrooms.  I WOULD NOT invite [some of] those with whom I participate in those types of venues to be a guest speaker in one of our SS classes or lead in worship.

    Secondary separation disallows all association.  Plus, as is the case w/ GARBC and Cedarville, association with someone like me who, while theologically conservative, associates in activities like I’ve described above with those who are not.

    Do you feel such a position is biblically justified?  If so, how?

    Wendi

  • Posted by

    Jesus said they would know we were Christians by our love—not who is to be shunned.  It appears that they have taken lessons from the Jehovah’s Witnesses.
    Be blest

  • Posted by Bart

    Wendi,
    The point I was trying to make is not a justification of GARBC separation, but an understanding of their position.  I believe they have taken this a step, no probably two or three steps too far.  I know of churches that would not associate with my church because we are not King James version only, and we sing songs that are not hymns.  They consider that inappropriate just like my example.  While I too belong to a ministerial association that does community events, I am sometimes uncomfortable with all the community worship services that seem to have no connection to Christ.  I still participate, but I sometimes wonder where that line of separation should be.

  • Posted by Wes

    Wendi, I have appreciated your comments that I’ve read to date but have to say that your comment copied below is very incorreect:

    “But Bart . . . your examples don’t work here.  The SBC has a very clear statement of faith to which all SBC pastors must adhere in order to be part of the SBC.  Included is the virgin birth, deity and bodily resurrection of Christ, and salvation by grace through faith as the only means to salvation. “

    These are statements found in our 2000 (and previous versions) Baptist Faith and Message but pastors are not reguired to sign anything stating their adhearance to them. I have been a Baptist minister for over 20 years and was reared in the Sothern Baptist system of faith so I come with some basis of knowledge. To be fair some or all of our seminaries and other institutions have required or tried to require this action of the professors or staff members but the pastor in the pulpit has not and as a rule most Southern Baptist would not stand for it, me being one. To connect to a previous article the disagreement with this attempted action was a component in the election of Frank Page as SBC President.

    Local Autonomy is a kingpin of Baptist polity and none of our local, state, or national organizations has any authority over the local church. Now back to the topic at hand.

    It is ironic that the GARB has censured Cedarville because the SBC is too moderate. Recently the SBC executive board voted to remove (not financially support nor send messengers) the Southern Baptist from the BWA - Baptist World Alliance, because some of the BWA denominations and churches teach doctrines that conflict with SBC doctrines. This was and is an unpopular decision among many Southern Baptists. So what do those churches in disagreement do? They choose to directly affiliate with the BWA and send financial support. The Executive Committee can do what they want to do and the local church can do what they want to do.

    BTW, I am a Kentucky pastor but went to the Ohio Baptist State Meeting at Cedarville last February. They had a great lineup of speakers. I was very impressed with the school. It seemed like one I would recommend to a prospective student. I had no idea it had been or was GARB connected. I didn’t know but assumed it was an SBC affiliated school. Again, ironically, many of our SBC connected schools are seeking to separate from the SBC connection. For one example Georgetown College in Georgetown, KY is moving to be an independant school not affilated with the KY Baptist State Convention.

    Also ironically, while I enjoyed the music, many of my Southern Baptist brothers and sisters would not have liked it’s contemporary nature and would not recommend Cedarville because it wasn’t conservative enough. However, I do not mean to start another ‘style of music’ debate.

  • Posted by

    On the surface this all seems like a waste of ink to even discuss, but underneath it unfortunately has become quite complicated and most likely...ugly.  I am a Cedarville graduate and I love the school.  During my time there I never understood why the GARB tie seemed so strong.  Cedarville looked nothing like every example of GARB I had ever experienced (and this remains true 10 years later).  In my basic understanding I do think that the “separation” is a bit ridiculous and a kind of a “futile last stand”, but if that is their conviction, then so be it.  On a human level, it seems pointless and will only cause GARB to become even more obscure than it already is, but that’s their prerogative. 

    On another note, many should have seen this coming years ago.  Cedarville has been becoming “close” with the SBC for years now and with the exiting of Dr. Dixon, they lost their main personal tie with GARB.  In addition to that Cedarville has regularly strived to keep pace with culture and technology, which have long since been the enemy of GARB.  My only concern in this is for Cedarville.  Will there be professor’s (because there are many great ones) that will be forced to choose between the institution they love and the ministry God has called them to and a dying association of churches.  Will there be financial hardship as a result of the “separation” as Cedarville is funded by many caring and wonderful doners.  And finally, my prayer is that Cedarville can rise above the pettiness of this and not allow itself to be defined by any one act or “separation”, but rather follow God in all that He has for them.

  • Posted by

    Warning – Rant follows – I was raised in an ultra-conservative church that taught all the various degrees of separation, enforced strict church discipline thru intimidation and shunning, and preached non-stop about how wrong the other Churches in town were. 

    Actions like this by GARBC are just another example of how Christianity is in ways self-destructing.  As baffling as this action is to many here (devout Christians all, I assume) think how this plays to the unchurched.

    Many unchurched see Christianity today as fragmented groups involved in bitter fighting slinging hate-filled rhetoric back and forth.  They hear Christians preaching the love of Jesus Christ, but then the same Christians are often saying listen to us and us only, all those others groups are wrong, they pervert the Word of God.

    And what do they hear about Christianity in the media?  Not the good, not the love of Jesus Christ.  No, they hear the controversies, the disputes and in-fighting.  They hear that GARBC will not recommend a college that associates with the SBC because the SBC is not conservative enough.  The SBC not conservative enough?  They hear that the Episcopal Church has elected a woman to be the head of their church and that many Christians are choosing to separate from the Episcopal Church rather than have a woman in authority over them.  They hear that the Episcopal Church is tearing itself apart in a bitter battle for control between homophobic conservatives and heresy preaching liberals.  They hear (and see) Christians saying that Methodists do this, and Lutherans do that, and Catholics don’t believe like I do, so don’t listen to them.  Enough!

    Have you heard the saying “All roads lead to Rome”.  Today can’t all Christian Churches lead people to Jesus Christ?  If the Lutherans or Methodists or Baptists or whoever haven’t got it quite 100% right, can’t they still bring people into a relationship with Jesus Christ where Jesus can lead them to the right path?  Shouldn’t we focus more on how lost the unchurched are rather than how wrong the other Christian denominations are?

  • Posted by Todd Rhoades

    Here are a couple of official documents from the GARBC on the issue.  The first is an address at the GARBC convention by national representative John Greening.  You can find that here:

    http://www.garbc.org/conference/?page_id=47

    The second is the GARBC’s official statement regarding separation.  You can find that here:

    http://www.garbc.org/c18statement.php

    I thought some might find both interesting.

    BTW, I believe Cedarville to still be a great school.  Matter of fact, I hope my kids will take a strong look at it when it’s time.

    Todd

  • Posted by

    Wes - Wes –

    I stand corrected, but a bit confused.  I am currently part of a BGC church, previously with an EFCA church.  In both cases, in order to call ourselves BGC or EFCA we had to adopt the denominational statement of faith.  In other words, the BGC statement of faith is our local church’s statement of faith.  Same with the EFCA.  In both cases it is part of our constitution.

    Of course, I don’t know if my pastors every had to sign anything.  And in both cases above local church autonomy is indeed a high value of the denomination.  But I’ve always found this to be in areas of operations, governance, ministry methodology and non-essential doctrinal issues (those not found on the statement of faith).

    Are you saying that an SBC pastor could regularly teach from his pulpit something contrary to the SBC doctrinal statement and the regional SBC folks would not show up to protect the orthodoxy of the SBC doctrines?  If so, that is quite surprising to me.  It was differences regarding these (core SBC doctrines) that Bart was describing as things which would/could cause him to question worshiping together. 

    Wendi

  • Posted by KYWes

    Actually, yes that could happen. An SBC pastor is not required to sign or abide by any creed or statement of faith by the denomination. The local church would have their own requirements. Similarily a local church is not required to sign a statement of faith to the best of my knowledge. However, becoming an SBC is reviewed and if a church desiring to be a part of the SBC did not follow norms they would not be allowed to become a part of the SBC. Each association has their own criteria. Again, generally a church would not choose to be a part if they were not in agreement.

    If a pastor leads his church to divert too much from SBC norms they can be removed as a cooperating church, this usually happens at the associational level. Normally it is not a problem as the differing church would elect to withdraw. Some SBC churches have done just this with the conservative resurgence, but the denomination does not have a yea or nay say, it is generally left up to the church. Some church are dually aligned that is SBC and CBF and a local pastor I know wants to lead his church to cut ties with the SBC and become dually aligned with the SBF and BWA.

    Interestingly, and for the most part unspoken, if a church will make regular contributions to our Cooperative Program they are left alone unless they get too radical, but in that I mean denying the diety of Jesus Christ. So as with so many things it boils down to financial criteria.

    What many do not understand is that there is not an SBC Doctrine of Faith. The Baptist Faith and Message is a compendium of Southern Baptist beliefs but it is not a binding document.

    This leads to a great difference in the SBC in their churches as you might expect. Here in Louisville we have conservative SBC churches that I would call fundamentalist and liberal churches who have no problem with woman ordination or same sex marriage even though both are not acceptable as per the 2000 Baptist Faith and Message.

    I call it the blessing and the curse of the SBC. A blessing because of the liberty each church enjoys but a curse because an outsider looking at SBC churches might think they have no similarities at all.

    Overall I like the SBC but I’m not in lockstep with the Executive Board. We contribute to the Cooperative Program and thus give financial support to missionaries here and abroad. We also receive assistance, mainly training and consultation, from our local, state, and national groups. We are independant governmentally but cooperatively part of a large worldwide organization. A pretty good situation I think.

    The differences Bart describes then would be personal preference not denominational preference or dictate. I prefer to not fellowship too much with people of differing views but I do not disengage from local ministerial associations. Depending on the situation I may or may not lead my church to be involved in a area wide, multi-denominational function...and I have that priviledge.

  • Posted by

    Thanks Wes – very informative.  I had indeed made some assumptions about denominations that obviously do not carry with the SB.

    I guess, at the end of the day, it is the autonomy (not the liberalism) of the SBC with regard to its churches that caused the GARBC to disassociate with them.  Because there are SOME SB churches that are more liberal they must separate.  They would have to then disassociate with every denomination that does not keep a very tight rein on its member churches and pastors.

    Oh my how sad . . .  I agree with Dan’s rant.  What fools we make of ourselves (unnecessarily) in the eyes of the lost.  I’ve posted this statistic before here at MMI, but this situation with the GARBC is the very reason that North America is the only continent on the planet where the Christian church is decreasing instead of growing.  I would like to know the conversion growth statistics in GARBC churches in the past 10 years. 

    Wendi

  • Posted by Wes

    It is a sad state. One, at least I, can be appreciative of their holding to their convictions, whether one agrees or not. Yes, they will lose members or at least gain few but I’m sure they would say it isn’t worth prostituting their beliefs to gain members. Well, they may not use that terminology but it’s what it is in some cases. In a world where it seems we are letting everything be diluted and politically correct it is seeming more and more neccessary to hold to essential distinctinves. does a church honor God if it is large, or small, but is shallow doctrinally? Are people really coming to a faith in Christ or a mere assention of His existence. God will sort it out.

    There is also a movement among some to discipline church members who do not follow a strict line or won’t sign a church covenant. See Mark Dever’s “The Deliberate Church”.  While I understand the intent I question the overall and long term effectiveness.

  • Posted by

    In an event of what has been previously posted or written, The GARBC knows where it stands on issues. I read the statement by John Greening and agree or disagree with their decision one must respect that they unwaiveringly know where they stand. They are an association that you can choose to be a part of or not and one of their stances is secondary seperation. Some associations can be too broad and some too narrow but at least one could look at the GARBC’s decision and know foresure whether or not you want to associate with them and that I have to respect.

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