Ahh… and me of yours!

Todd

1) Know all about this boycott. It was suggested to me that we sell my hubby’s vehicle because it is a Ford and buy a new one from a different maker. WHAT? My hubby’s vehicle is long since paid for and is 12-years-old. We’re supposed to go in debt because of a boycott? I don’t think so.

2) TD Jakes on Imus? Should he be commenting? I don’t know. He didn’t ask me.

3) The Masters and Zach Johnson.... For the record: I do not have a golfing bone in my body. Golf is HUGE to many people in my daily life for obvious reasons given where we live. Zach Johnson represents the only real Master whether he wins or loses. For that, I am most thankful.

5) King James? Personally no longer use it for daily study or teaching. Know many who still say it is the only Bible period. I think this issue will always be with us.

I say… Give us what you truly have the time for given what all is on your plate.

I boycott boycotts
TD Jakes lives in America, say what you want.
I got a hole in one once in spite of the windmill but did not get a green jacket.
To start a church, it was 1996 and one of the best things I ever did.
I like Keven James, James Brown, James Hendrix, Jamestown, do not like Bartles and James or King James
Keep rambling, it makes me look organized.

Boycotts - Generally I don’t think Christians should be involved in this kind of stuff.  It always reminds me of some lines from a song by Steve Taylor years ago called Guilty by Association --- You know I’m spending all my money
In the Kingdom now
And I only drink milk
From a Christian cow

King James fanatics - Had a Bible School professor who was KJV only.  This viewpoint was baffling to me then, and it’s still baffling.  Though I do still enjoy reading some of the Psalms in KJV.  The language seems more poetic too me.  But then, I also like Shakespeare.

Thoughts on the KJV--actually had a lady in my church come up to me and tell me that the Bible version I was using to preach from (the TNIV) was the latest in a long line of Bible translations that Satan was using to bastardize the Word of God and lead us all into the “one world religion” and the worship of Satan.

Yeah. It was weird.

2) What’s the worst ‘non-theological’ thing you’ve ever said as a church staff member that’s gotten you in trouble (or fired)? I’ve always been fairly free in talking about my faith at work, without much backlash.  A few years ago, though, after promotion to a “senior management” level (in a company of 900, I was running a department of 40), I did get a talking-to by my boss.  It seems that one of the managers that worked for me was offended by my reference to some church-related management lesson I’d learned and shared in a meeting with her and her two fellow managers.  There was certainly no proselytizing, but she was decidedly non-religious and took offense to my church reference.  Surprisingly, I never heard anything from my boss about her being offended by a comment I made in a one-on-one discussion with her; I’d said something a bit derisive about those who treat animals as if they are as important as people...and she apparently was among those!  I didn’t get fired, but I did learn that I have to be careful what I say and how it might be perceived.

1) Boycotts hurt working families who have no control over policy. 

2) I’ve also wondered how many of them have cd’s they’ve paid good money for with the same kind of language with the same intent.  Don’t hear much from the good Reverends on that.  Not that that excuses Imus, mind you.  Shame on him.  In terms of Jakes, it’s a free country. 

3) Congratulations to Zach Johnson!

4) We left the last church after my son asked me what the guy up front was talking about and I realized I didn’t have an answer for him.  No life change, no spiritual growth, no applicability on a daily basis.  All ritual, no relationship.  I wanted a real relationship with Jesus Christ - for my kids and for me.

5) KJV left me confused and clueless.  Didn’t even understand what they were saying, let alone knowing how to apply it.  I love the NIV, Life Application.

Love the blog!

OK, I’ll jump in.  What Don Imus said was offensive and reprehensible.  That said, what he said is nothing that almost every rap and hip hop artist hasn’t said repeated times in lyric.  Why is it that the black community is not up in arms about the lyrics of 2 live crew and other such hip hop groups?  Where is the outrage when rap and hip hop artists promulgate degrading and denigrating attitudes in their songs?

Where was the black community’s outrage when Miss Jones recorded and played the racist Tsunami Song mocking the Asian victims of the tsunami that hit south asia?  Why is it OK with the black community for a black DJ to be overtly racist?  Racism can’t be wrong when it is aimed at you but OK when it’s aimed at someone else.  It has to be just wrong.

There’s no doubt Don Imus was wrong and his employers should take whatever action they feel is appropriate, but the outrage being expressed by some of the self-anointed leaders of the black community like Al Sharpton just feels overdone.

I think T.D. Jakes could have stayed out of this.  Or maybe he is trying to be the next Al Sharpton.

As for boycotts I don’t pay much attention to other people’s boycotts, although I am still boycotting Exxon over the Alaska oil spill.  And I didn’t even know we were supposed to be boycotting Ford. And further, my kids are not going to let me boycott Disney, it’s their favorite channel.

KJV only folks make me crazy.  It is what I grew up but I can’t buy the argument that it’s the “inspired” translation.  I just don’t see God inspiring a translation with apparent translational errors.

Do boycotts really work?  Sometimes they do, sometimes they don’t.  I think in the case of Ford, it is working.  And also in the case of Walmart over the holidays.  They certainly did a big turn around right before the holiday shopping rush.  (when they were going to donate a percentage of every internet sales to homosexual activists) So, somebody was listening.

And should ‘Christians’ be boycotting companies?  I think it’s up to your own convictions.  I don’t want to be guilted for not boycotting a company.  But some companies go too far.  I personally boycott Victoria’s Secret and Abercrombie and Fitch, because I don’t appreciate soft porn at the mall.  I was also ready to boycott Walmart. 

But you can’t change everybody.  And Christians in the early church obviously bought meat sacrificed to idols (or at least some did, and others were ticked about it).  If I boycotted everybody that did anything that was not Christian, I would be making my own clothes, and growing my own food, that’s for sure, especially here in LDS country.

Not sure of what I think of T.D. Jake’s comments, and never been fired from a ministry or made public theological statements that were all that bad… I don’ t think! 

Why did we leave our last church?  We were in Filipino ministry in California for 7 years.  And it was time.  Our call was to establish the ministries of the church, raise up indigenous leadership and walk away.  And we did that with 7 areas of ministry.  And when it was time to go, it was time.  And that was a joyous leaving.  Then we became lay people for a time, in a self imposed furlough.  Our family needed it.  We were weary and needed to ease back into our own culture.  (Sounds funny because we were in the states after all, but our kids were speaking Tagalog and totally immersed in the culture)

Have you been a past proponent of the “King James Only” camp.  What changed your mind?
Nope.  Never been in that camp.  I think the whole premise is ridiculous.  And some of the contortions I’ve heard to justify the view, have been absolutely bad theology.  For example, one I’ve heard is that there was a re-inspiring of scripture when the King James version was translated.  Hmmmmm....

And yeah, Todd, this combined thought ramble is a lot of fun!
Thanks once again.

Jan

Boycotts – I wish they were just stupid, ineffective and irrelevant - - - but I actually think Christian boycotts are irrelevant like the Pharisees were irrelevant.  The Pharisees gave the people of God a bad name, made the “outsiders” look better than the “insiders,” and of course affected backward rather than forward kingdom progress.  Isn’t it great that the Christians actually are proud for being known for causing hard working Americans to lose their jobs?

Imus and TD Jakes – I agree with Leonard.  This is America.  Jakes can say what he wants.  I agree with this: [True healing will come only when individuals honestly address the root of their remarks, rather than making excuses for them, and only when employers and advertisers in our society respond immediately and decisively.] Too often I excuse something wrong I’ve said by explaining why I said it.  If a consequence of Imus’ stupid and arrogant remarks was that he’d lose his job . . . I’d be pleased.

More than once (I’m a slow learner) I’ve gotten in trouble for using e-mail to communicate something that should have been discussed face-to-face.  Used scripture as a weapon instead of a balm.

I love watching golf, can’t swing a club.  I always root for Phil over Tiger, and can’t understand why Tiger intimidates so many talented guys.  Way to go Zach, for seeing this as an opportunity to make comments that made us (Jesus) look good . . . rather than ridiculous (like the “boycott Ford” guys).

I do not get those KJV guys.  How did they decide that a translation, over 1000 years removed from the original NT manuscripts was the only “accurate” reading.  For heaven sake, there are mistakes in copies reproduced in the same language within a few years of their origin.  Not to mention, as Peter pointed out, that many of its words mean something completely different today than they did to our friend James.  Come on . . . this argument is like insisting that we all use the language of the Native American Indians since they had the first language here.

Wendi

1) Should Christians boycott?  Only on a personal level.  I don’t drink alcohol by choice.  Since my boycott of Budweiser, it has not effected them.  Those who home school their children...those who don’t use tobacco products.  I think we should exert positive influences.  When a movie comes out that supports Christian values, we should vote with our money. 

2) What’s the worst non-theological thing I have said as a staff member that got me in trouble or fired?  Can’t think of any.

3) Zack Johnson - a Southern Baptist.  Hooray! 

4) Why did I leave my past church?  Didn’t want to...God called me.  The present church asked for my resume.  We left one wonderful church for another.

5) King James fanatics...Have you been a past proponent of the “King James Only” Camp.  What changed your mind?  No.  I grew up with the King James and my memory works is King James.  When I began teaching youth, I found the NIV was more acceptable with the children (after checking with my pastor who preached from the King James but it was out of tradition and habit - he pointed out the differences and said use the NIV).  In my chaplain duties at a veterans’ home I use the KJV because it is most familiar with the older vets.

As far as the KJV goes, I lean toward it only because I was raised up on it .  I use the NKJV a lot now because of the updated words.  When I write sermons I actually compare all the translations that is offered by e-sword, (a couple or three dozen, I think) and I actually speak the Word as plain talk that anybody can understand which is what God I think wants us to do.  It has been stated that the Lord does not like vain repitition so the way I look at it I read the different versions and teach them in the terminology of today.