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    Bloggers Take Aim at Another Prominent SBC Church

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    Sutton is pastor to many of the SBC’s most powerful leaders and employees. The denomination’s headquarters office, publishing arm, news outlet and related agencies are located in Nashville.

    But other high-profile churches have been roiled recently by controversy over pastoral leadership.

    Accusations of autocratic decision-making against pastors who followed long-tenured leaders hit two massive churches in suburban Memphis. Disputes within Bellevue Baptist Church in Cordova, Tenn., and Germantown Baptist Church in Germantown, Tenn., led to dissident factions starting websites to broadcast their disagreements and ultimately led Germantown pastor Sam Shaw to resign.

    At First Baptist Church of Daytona Beach, Fla., where former SBC president Bobby Welch was the longtime pastor, his successor, David Cox, resigned abruptly in January after months of disputes with a faction in the congregation. And First Baptist Church of Raytown, Mo., near Kansas City, underwent a highly publicized dispute and lawsuit after a former church member accused the son of longtime pastor Paul Brooks of sexually assaulting and impregnating her while the son, Mark, was on the church’s staff.

    Sutton, a former SBC first vice president, finished third in a highly contentious 2006 SBC presidential election, despite the endorsement of major leaders of the SBC’s conservative establishment.

    Unlike other recent church fights involving prominent megachurch pastors, the Two Rivers conflict includes a dispute over a hastily called business meeting in which a majority of those present kicked out the church member who has been leading the charge against Sutton—despite the fact that he was one of the congregation’s three legal trustees.

    The Associated Press first reported Aug. 14 that the congregation was in upheaval over allegations publicized by Frank Harris, the trustee, who is a longtime member. Among his contentions were that Sutton inappropriately spent more than $4,000 of church funds on a wedding reception for his daughter, improperly met with representatives of a resort hotel who wanted to buy some of the church’s property, and was autocratic and attempted to keep church members in the dark about his finances.

    Two Rivers “appears to have been manipulated from a people-led church to a staff-run church,” the AP quoted Harris as saying. “Anyone who voiced opposition to leadership was alienated and lost any ministries they may have had in the church.”

    The congregation’s deacons and personnel committee met July 15 to discuss the charges, including accusations by a former church secretary that Sutton looked at pornography on his office computer and had an affair with a church staff member. The charges again were discussed July 28 in a churchwide question-and-answer sessions.

    In a statement posted on the Two Rivers website Aug. 15, church officials attempted to refute the arguments. “After full review and discussion, it was unanimously determined by both the deacons and the human resource ministry team that the senior pastor had not committed any wrongdoing as claimed, and that there was no basis whatsoever to bring charges against, discipline or be concerned about the conduct of the senior pastor,” the statement said.

    It said that the money for the reception had been approved by the church’s budget committee because the event was open to all church members. It also noted the church is audited by an external firm once a year and that “no financial improprieties have been found at any time during” Sutton’s 21-year tenure at Two Rivers.

    The statement also said Sutton’s dealings with the hotel owners had been proper and that a disputed church-paid trip he took to Italy and Israel was a legitimate mission endeavor and “not a vacation.” It added the sexual allegations had been investigated and dismissed in 2002, when they were first made. Church leaders again dismissed them in the July 15 meeting, it said.

    More here: SOURCE:  ABPNews.com

    The integrity of another prominent Southern Baptist pastor has been called into question by members of his megachurch -- this one in the shadow of the Southern Baptist Convention's headquarters. Local and national news agencies have reported a raging controversy over Jerry Sutton’s leadership of Two Rivers Baptist Church in Nashville, Tenn. Like many recent tiffs in large Southern Baptist churches, the conflict features allegations of improper financial decisions, accusations of an unaccountable and autocratic pastor, and a website where aggrieved members publicize the controversy.

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    1. Ricky on Mon, August 20, 2007

      From the article:


      “...an unaccountable and autocratic pastor…”


      “Accusations of autocratic decision-making…”


      “...after a former church member accused the son of longtime pastor Paul Brooks of sexually assaulting and impregnating her while the son, Mark, was on the church’s staff.”


      “’Anyone who voiced opposition to leadership was alienated and lost any ministries they may have had in the church.’”


      This would be hilarious if not such a sad indictment against the “church” that Jesus built.


      Oh, wait.  Jesus didn’t build any of the “churches” listed in the article, men did.


      Well, that explains it.


      This is a systemic problem and one that will continue as long as man believes that he is to “run the church” as he sees fit.

    2. Peter Hamm on Mon, August 20, 2007

      Ignoring the first comment (as hard as it is for me to do that…)…


      Once again the question arises as to what is the proper format for dissent within a church. A blog is not it. The discussion we had recently on this subject where the bloggers actually got involved in the discussion, really cemented that for me.

    3. Leonard on Mon, August 20, 2007

      looks like this stuff is here to stay, it is really too bad we mixed our personal rights with what is biblically right and diluted the latter.  As long as people feel entitled to complain they will.  Until people deal with the scriptures…do all things without murmering and disputing… this stuff is now a part of how disgruntled people handle problems.

    4. bishopdave on Mon, August 20, 2007

      Earlier this year, I had the privilige of being the subject of a 4 page anonymous letter sent to everyone on the church mailing list. I mean everyone. Non-members, inactive, shut-ins. Thankfully, the church responded appropriately.


      I’m grateful these folks weren’t smart enough to get their own blog going. They wanted change without working through the accpeted means (church by-laws) because they knew they didn’t have the influence or support to move the appropriate boards to take their desired action.


      I don’t know why the lesson isn’t communicated. If working through proper channels doesn’t result in the changes you think God has decreed for this body, how will accusations without evidence achieve His will? After all, who has a ministry of accusation? (Zech. 3)

    5. Eric Joppa on Mon, August 20, 2007

      I am conflicted after reading this article.


      I know that there are complainers and there are pastors that need to be watched.


      Too often people make statements, complaints, and accusations that may or may not be true about leaders, and then railroad them to the “powers that be” to get their way.


      I worked in a church a number of years ago that a situation like this was present.


      Complaints came about the youth pastor for years. they never did anything but make his life and ministry difficult. When they had no success attacking him directly, the attacked openly and viciously the Jr. High pastor that he had hired.


      The statements were general and baseless “I think he is off..” “I get a bad feeling about him…” “We need to have a change in that position…”


      After 5 years of attacks, they got their way and he was released. It was the right decision as he had begun to cease being a part of the team. It was later discovered that he had had “inappropriate relationships” with some female students in the ministry and the church went to the authorities. Nothing physical, but unhealthy things that scarred these girls badly.


      Those who complained, complained for no good reason. They just got lucky. They said things like… “I knew he was bad…” and “I had a feeling about him from day one…”


      All they really had were bad motives, faulty opinions, and an agenda. A church was destroyed because of that agenda, not the “bad youth worker”. If they had done things properly, instead of attacking, if they had gotten to know this uy, they may have been able to do something that would have stopped anything destructful from happening.


      All that to ask this question…


      How can we as pastors lead people to making good decisions when it comes to complaints, and disagreements so that these destructive practices can be curbed?

    6. Camey on Mon, August 20, 2007

      Eric,


      To try to help with your question… I always start off by asking if they have gone to the person they are complaining about first. If they have not - immediately direct them to do so. If they are unwilling to do so…. offer to go with them… If they are unwilling to go to that person at all - chances are they know they are really the problem. They just may not have fully admitted it to themselves yet. I would suggest not be willing to discuss the complaint until the person complaining is willing to deal with it.


      Bishopdave,


      You and your church are in my prayers.

    7. Leonard on Mon, August 20, 2007

      Eric, I think you should quit your job and come work for me… You will have to raise your support but I will let you drive my golf cart around. 


      It does not take a genius to realize something is wrong, especially with me.  It does take a brother to love someone into healthiness and that is something most are unwilling to do.

    8. Wendi on Mon, August 20, 2007

      I agree with Peter and others . . .


      Even if all the claims of the Three Rivers complainants were true, or even if there are worse legitimate complaints . . . even if Ricky’s incitement of “the church” or a particular church were true . . . I can’t see any biblical support for blogging as a remedy.  Worse case, if I have followed biblical guidelines for settling a dispute and/or expressing my disagreement with policies or practices.  I believe the only biblical response is to leave quietly. 


      As a mature Christian, I am (should be) able to discern if something is wrong with doctrine or ministry practice.  After expressing my concerns, if the response of the leaders, to whom I must submit, is unacceptable . . . the ball is in my court.  I can move on, able to look myself in the mirror for having voiced my concerns in a biblical manner.  My responsibility then becomes finding a place where I can submit to the church’s authority with integrity, and can invest my resources and gifts in kingdom ministry. 


      The folks at Three Rivers are trying to take over for the Holy Spirit.  While we have a responsibility to steward our influence, which may mean rightly expressing deep concerns, trying force change like this is manipulative and controlling behavior, and its sin. 


      Wendi

    9. Brad Raby on Mon, August 20, 2007

      After reading the statements and interviews, something tells me that pest ‘Purpose Driven Lies’ brochure is floating around again.


      The SBC trend here is interesting.  Most of these church with trouble has had one common denominator - a move to contemporary or more contemporary styles of ministry.  Bellevue, FBC Daytona, Two Rivers…


      Hmm…When you replace the tie with a band, crazy things just seem to happen.


      This is of course a generalization, but certainly a trend.

    10. Peter Hamm on Tue, August 21, 2007

      Brad,


      You could also say that these churches finally started really trying to minister in a relevant fashion and the old guard decided that wasn’t okay. So there’s two ways to look at it.

    11. Franklin Reeves on Thu, August 23, 2007

      I would say that a Biblical approach to wrong doing would be,


      1) go to the person you thin is wrong.


      2) then get witnesses to judge between you


      3) then take it to the whole assembly.


      4) if everyone thinks you are wrong, change your mind or leave.


      Of course if you were molested,raped, attacked, their is nothing wrong with calling the police.

    12. Brian L on Thu, August 23, 2007

      Part of the issue regarding how to handle these things lies in how the leadership as individuals handles complaints.


      I recently preached from Matthew 18, and said that if you talk to another person before you have talked to the person who “sinned against you,” then YOU are in sin.


      I expect all of my leadership to say what Camey suggests: “Have you gone to the person?  If not, then I am unable to help you except to maybe set up the meeting.  Jesus does not allow me to listen to gossip, and until you make the effort to contact this person somehow, then that’s what it is.”


      I would go so far as to say that a minister or someone might be able to suggest how to approach the offender, but to take no other action until then.


      This didn’t sit well with some, but my response is:  “Jesus invented the Church.  Doesn’t it make sense that He knows what’s best for it?  And therefore, doesn’t it make sense that we need to obey Him in dealing with conflict within the Church that He invented and died for?  To do anything else is to tell Jesus He doesn’t know what He’s talking about!  And I, for one, am not going to do that.”

    13. Ricky on Fri, August 24, 2007

      Wendi:


      “As a mature Christian, I am (should be) able to discern if something is wrong with doctrine or ministry practice.  After expressing my concerns, if the response of the leaders, to whom I must submit, is unacceptable . . . the ball is in my court.  I can move on, able to look myself in the mirror for having voiced my concerns in a biblical manner.”


      Well, Wendi, I would suppose that Paul would have been considered ‘immature,’ at least according to your standard as to what is “mature.”


      When Peter and Barnabas were caught in hypocrisy in their dealings with certain Gentile believers, Paul certainly “blogged” about it…in Scripture!  He called Peter on the carpet and rebuked him in the sight of all and then wrote about it.  And Peter wasn’t the only one that appeared on Paul’s “blogs.”


      And please advise where in Scripture believers are commanded to “submit to a church’s authority.”  This erroneous belief that by questioning and even challenging error is wrong or unbiblical is one major reason the Western Church has lost its integrity.  We don’t know how to police ourselves because we’re taught that to question someone, particularly someone who has placed themselves in a supposedly biblical position, is wrong.


      It’s time that we start realizing that when we don’t police ourselves, the Lord will allow the world to do it…to our shame.

    14. Peter Hamm on Fri, August 24, 2007

      Ricky,


      1. Paul would never have blogged about a disagreement with Peter, I don’t think. Do you? Because…


      2. Paul, as a recognized leader in the church and a very well-educated (theologically) man was acting in his appointed role when he acted correctly and confronted Peter to his face. Notice the text never says “And Paul and Barnabas encouraged the believers to grumble among themselves about what a hypocrite Peter was…”

    15. DanielR (a different Daniel) on Fri, August 24, 2007

      I’ve always liked this quote by Frank A. Clark. “We find comfort among those who agree with us–growth among those who don’t.”


      And I have learned and grown listening to people whom I disagree with.  But I’m not learning anything from your comments, Ricky, just the same old drivel.   It’s like Slice has started commenting on every post.


      There ARE Biblical ways to address issues and to approach confrontation and there are unbiblical ways.  Face-to-face conversation is the place to start, church meetings, church councils or boards, maybe even a newsletter to members of the church or even e-mail to members of the church could be acceptable depending on the circumstances.  Starting a blog for the public perusal of all those outside the church is NOT an acceptable, Biblical way to address issues or disagreements.

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