First Baptist Dallas: “We Need to Level the Playing Field with our Facilities”
- Posted by: Todd
- Posted on: Thu, January 10, 2008
- Viewed 128
- (17) comments so far
Here’s the quote that got my eye though. Read the last two paragraphs of the article:
But on Sunday, he also challenged the church to consider building a new youth and children’s center. First Baptist can compete with suburban megachurches, he argued, but it has to be a fair fight.
“We need to level the playing field with our facilities,” he said.
(First Baptist Dallas just opened “The Criswell Center” in Downtown Dallas in 2006. That building cost $49 million (the church still owes $9 million on that one).
The article also mentions Fellowship Church (pastored by Ed Young, Jr.), that has spent $12 million to establish a satellite church in downtown Dallas. Wonder if there’s any correlation between Fellowship coming into downtown and First Baptist needing to ‘level the playing field’ to compete with suburban megachurches?
Any thoughts?
There's an interesting article that was run recently in the Dallas News about First Baptist Dallas, the downtown mega-church. Their new pastor, Robert Jeffress, is calling on the church to build a new worship center in Downtown Dallas. Jeffress says "the finest facility in the heart of downtown Dallas ought to be a worship center dedicated to almighty God." The average weekly attendance at the church is around 3,000...
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Peter Hamm on Thu, January 10, 2008
So, I’m reading into this a bit, but…
Somebody moves into town who does more successful and perhaps more relevant ministry than I do, so I need to build a better facility than the other guy? Does anybody else see a flaw in that logic?
Daniel on Thu, January 10, 2008
Clearly, our goal is to attract people with the beauty of our buildings.
You know, sometimes I wish we made it a little bit harder to follow Jesus. Perhaps if we focused on his teachings that would be a little bit easier. Jesus said you should love Bin Laden. Jesus said you couldn’t serve both your money and him. Jesus said ‘blessed are the poor’. Jesus forbids us to lie. Jesus says how we live affects how we will be judged.
Instead of ‘attracting people’ with pretty buildings, how about we attract them with passionate worship of the Creator? How about we attract them with Spirit-inspired preaching? How about we attract them with hearts and hands of service?
No, clearly none of that is ‘good enough’…
Pardon my cynicism.
Eric Joppa on Thu, January 10, 2008
Compete? That is a word that I would have seen as a que that this pastor has his ambition and his God given vision mixed up. There are plenty of unchurched people in Downtown Dallas. If you are trying to compete with other churches, it will only be for other christians, not new believers.
-E
michael on Thu, January 10, 2008
so much for “other churches aren’t our competition.”
or maybe we should praise him for saying publicly what many other pastors think privately.
Leonard on Thu, January 10, 2008
What is so “funny” is he is actually reported saying the very thing many pastors think. As they see a big church grow next to them, many pastors think; “How can I compete with that?” I would venture to say, most if not all have thought this way for a moment or longer.
My guess is that he is not really saying, he lets compete with those other churches, but rather we cannot have the same impact they are having in our current facility. The tone of the whole article was not as bad as the excerpt made it seem.
I believe the frustrating part for me is this. When another church is having a great impact, we should look and see why; hopefully we can learn something that will help us in Kingdom work. When the growth is attributed merely to a building, something was missed.
andy on Thu, January 10, 2008
There’s a mall south of where we live that has been the “best mall in the area” for some time. Recently another outdoor “lifestyle center” mall was built to our north and everyone who used to shop at the “best mall” started going to the “lifestyle center” for their shopping. So what does the “best mall” do?
Build new stuff that feels more like the Lifestyle Center. Now everyone’s back there shopping.
It’s just like church…. err…. I mean…. which one is just like the other.
here’s the thing. If we’re going to build and sustain “mega” anything there’s always going to be stuff like this. There is no way that care and community can be at the core of churches that big and most of the people attending are probably not looking for those things anyway. They probably want the glits and glamour that comes from great facilities. The problem is way bigger than viewing other churches as competition. It runs to the core of what we value most and which of those values we teach our people.
Joe Martino on Thu, January 10, 2008
Yes, I have some thoughts, but they’re not good ones. I hate buildings with a passion. Yes, my church meets in a building. Thankfully, the leadership is very minimalistic about it though. “Level the playing field?” So, he’s saying, “Our Building Rules!! Come HERE!” That’s dumb.
For far too many people buildings are an idol. How many church splits occur over a building? How many churches have died because the building took up too much of their budget? This article makes me sick to my stomach.
ChasB4TN on Thu, January 10, 2008
I would be interested in seeing the congregations reaction to the pastor’s vision. Also, It is interesting to me to see this presentation in light of the Aug.death of Mrs. Criswell and if he would have presented this plan if she was still alive.
Ron Geyer on Thu, January 10, 2008
Nothing wrong with updating facilities; nothing wrong with using facilities as an expression of the church’s personality; but once the words “compete” and “level the playing field” - directed at another church and not at the Enemy - enter the conversation, it’s all wrong. It’s a shame that we continue to see soul-winning as a zero-sum game.
Charles on Thu, January 10, 2008
I can just hear a new book to be released, “ How to attract and keep church shoppers and consumer Christians” . LOL, This isn’t an arms race here boys. This sounds like football coaches, saying that they can’t recruit like the school down the road because the facilities aren’t up to specs. Get me a new stadium or i’m leaving. Can’t we celebrate others winning souls for the Kingdom? .......God calls us to be faithful, right.
Dallas on Thu, January 10, 2008
Member of FBD here
People hate it when we use the term compete but the other churches owe us a great debt of gratitude for all the members that have left the concrete jungle for the new guys.
Yes there are alot of lost people downtown and we arok to reach them but the 10,000 people that live downtown are not the target audience that pays the bills. If we are to stay downtown we must “compete”, if not we must close. We feel God wants us alive and expects us to take the steps necessary to be the lighthouse we have always been.
PLease pray for us, this is a huge undertaking as we try to be faithful to His plan.
To answer a few questions
Yes he would have presented if Mrs. C were here. This is God’s plan, Dr. C presented the same as have others since 1968.
Everyone is so afraid of the truth, churches compete with each other everyday. GET OVER IT.
matt on Thu, January 10, 2008
No offense Dallas, but as another minister at another sizable church in Dallas proper, we don’t owe FBC anything other than perhaps a nod to compatriots. What a terrible attitude to have.
“don’t pay the bills?” are you serious?
Eric Joppa on Fri, January 11, 2008
Dallas,
I agree with you that some churches do compete with each other, but it is not the norm where I am from, nor is it ok in any place. when a church leader or leadership communicates that “we are in competition with another fellowship” they are leading poorly. We are not in competition with anyone but Satan for souls.
I am in a smaller church that is growing, (we are around 200 and recently jumped to 230-250). We are in a city that has one of the fastest growing and most influential churches in America. Some of our people say things like “It’s easy to get people to come to church when you water down the message” and “the world loves you if you look like a Rock concert.”
Anytime I hear this kind of comment, I tell them that we need to celebrate what is happening in our church and in theirs. Each is a victory for God. Any other attitude is one of a sinful jealous heart. If you think you are in competition with another church, there are a couple of things wrong IMHO,
1. Your focus is about numbers, who has more.
2. You might be focussing on your glory and not Gods.
Just my thoughts,
-E
Opie on Sat, January 12, 2008
I’m sick of church. Everywhere I go, all I see are people bashing each other. Who are any of us to say anything? Are any of us doing something positive for the Kingdom of God by sitting here feeling high and mighty as we judge this pastor?
The people going to FBCD probably wouldn’t even be drawn to Fellowship, so there is no competition despite what anyone does or says.
Jade on Tue, January 15, 2008
I am not sure God cares if Dallas finest facility is dedicated to Him or not. I don’t remember Christ being to interested in buildings, but people.
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