The Right Way to Do Church
- Posted by: Todd
- Posted on: Fri, December 02, 2005
- Viewed 127
- (69) comments so far
I have noticed in the world of the internet a quite lively debate over "the right way" to do church. In my mind this is a DANGEROUS place to be--declaring that one way is right and every other way is wrong.
But the debate is raging...traditional vs. contemporary--house church vs. mega church--postmodern vs. well...I don't know what THEY are against--usually everything!!!
My point is that people get trapped into thinking that there is one way to do church--and if other churches are NOT doing church that way then they are WRONG. And to take that even further...the people in the churches that feel as if they are right openly criticize and condemn...and some have even staged protests outside of other churches.
Uh, somehow I am not thinking that is what Jesus meant when He called us to love one another AND to make disciples.
People ask me, "Is the way NewSpring doing church the RIGHT way." My response is always, "No, it is a different way!" There are so many different people in this world...and it is going to take so many different styles to reach them. To claim that there is ONE worship style that is right is both narrow minded and egotistical. And to attack people who ARE NOT compromising the Gospel...but are also NOT compromising Scripture is both arrogant and wrong.
There are several questions that I think need to be asked when evaluating a ministry to see if it is in line...
#1 - Is It Growing?
Jesus called us to reach people--period. Healthy things grow--period. And NO ONE can make a BIBLICAL case for a church remaining small & not caring about the community in which it exists.
I hear it from time to time, "We're small--but we love each other and it is our call to minister to one another." That is a partial truth...it is A PART of our call...but another part is to go and reach people for Christ. A church that is inward focused & gives the community the middle finger and tells them to go to hell is not doing it right--period.
It's not about the style of worship either. There is a church right up the road in Easley that is growing like mad--and they are as traditional as they come. We must be VERY careful NEVER to confuse methodology with theology!
#2 - Is It Scriptural?
I say win the game no matter what--but if a team is caught cheating the ref throws a flag. I am all for doing whatever it takes to reach people; however, Scripture must never be compromised.
Now here is where people will look at churches like NewSpring and claim we are compromising Scripture by not dressing up...or they will condemn the fact that we have a band--things like that.
The problem is that these objections are based on personal preferences rather than precepts, and that is a dangerous line to cross.
I once heard of a legalist objecting to rock and roll music because it had a "4-4" beat. But as I remember flipping through the hymnals that exist in many churches most of the songs were written in...uh...yep...4-4 time.
#3 - Is It Engaging?
I think there is one word to describe a church that is boring--SIN!
Look at it this way--God is not boring. He invented laughter. He invented the sunset. He's the One who developed the concept of sex! (Thank you Jesus!)
And Jesus--He was not a boring dude. He was always telling stories...and wherever He went there was this crowd that followed Him. (So much for keeping it small!) And when He walked on the water...or turned water into wine--trust me--he engaged people.
And the Holy Spirit--one good read through Acts chapter two will highlight the fact that when He moves it is completely obvious!
And the Bible--this is the most exciting book ever written. There are stories of war, romance, kings and queens, you name it--it's in there.
Unfortunately I know of many churches who have taken God, Jesus, the Spirit, and the Bible and made them the most boring and irrelevant things on the planet.
God is NOT boring--His Bride should not be either!
These three questions are things that I use to evaluate this ministry. To be honest, I don't have time to go around and inspect other people, churches, and ministries, take the time to listen to the messages that the teachers in that church does, read all the things that comes out of that church, and then criticize that ministry through random e-mails and blog comments. (I would argue that a person who does have time for that needs a few things...such as a job...)
I know we are not perfect--we never will be. I tell this church often that as long as I am the pastor that things will probably be screwed up around here. However, I believe with all of my heart that we are doing exactly what Jesus has called us to do...and that we are doing it exactly how He has called us to do it. And that is the conviction that a pastor and the leadership of a church must have.
So--style--doesn't matter. Dress--doesn't matter. Political preferences--doesn't matter. The thing we need to agree on is this--let's love Jesus with everything we've got--and love one another that way as well. That is His call on our lives--not to point out the faults that exist--but to strengthen, encourage, and build one another up.
Are we doing things right? Yes--for where we are, for our church--yes. Does this mean that other churches need to do exactly what we are doing? Nope! That's my thoughts on the matter--what are yours?
FOR DISCUSSION: I don't really expect a whole lot of people to agree with Perry here. Mostly, I think, because the people who agree are the one who don't post comments. What I will expect is, as Perry discusses above, a complete critique of why Perry is so off on his thinking (and how wrong he is in the way NewSpring is carrying out their Kingdom work). There will no doubt be talk of megachurches, Rick Warren, musical style, and theological watering down.
Thanks, Perry... for putting into words my feelings. Here's what I've been pondering. Why is all of this so? Why are the critics out in such mass at blogs like this one? I've been scratching my head about this alot lately. Many who criticize distance themselves from anything new in the church; but are very good at new technologies like blogging. Is it like it is in most churches... that a few people are the critics; but they are make the impression that their number is much bigger than they really are?
Here's my point? It seems like the internet and blogosphere is downright jammed full of church leader critics... but I don't think their number is that big in reality. Some will say that I'm just not dealing with reality... but I think it's true. Rick Warren is the perfect example... how many people have read PD Life? How many churches have done the 40 days campaigns in their churches? Literally THOUSANDS. Thousands of churches have run the program and speak highly of it. But even whisper the name Rick Warren on a blog; and you're instantly inundated with only his opponents. Yesterday, I posted on how Rick Warren had said he had repented of his sin of overlooking the AIDS epidemic. The responses ranged from Warren wanting only the spotlight; judgement that he should've repented earlier; to charges that he's in the big drug companies' pockets. But I guess that's just internet criticism for ya.
Any thoughts? (and I will take the liberty to edit if need be) 
Perry Noble wrote a great piece this week at his blog about all the internet talk about the ‘right way’ to do church… It’s a great read. Perry wrote…
Comments
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Phil Hoover-Chicago on Fri, December 02, 2005
Todd,
Great post, and great “re-post.”
There really isn’t just “one way” to do church. But that seems to be the problem…we are far more concerned with how we “do church” than we are with “being the church.” Let me explain:
If I’m not “the church” (or at least a part of it) to those with whom I worship on Sundays—during the rest of the week—then how I/we/they “do church” really isn’t very important in the greater scheme of things.
I do prefer to sing at least two hymns, as well as some of the newer choruses—because they speak strong, Biblical truth. They admonish/teach us. But what about when I leave the facilities, and go home…or go to my job…or interact with others. How well am I “being the church” for those around me?
I have read Purpose-Driven Life—and I loved it! I’m a committed Wesleyan/Pentecostal, but PDL is probably one of the very best discipleship tools that I have ever seen. Pastor Warren has done the Body of Christ a wonderful service with this great book.
And now we must learn to “be the church”—and that becomes very challenging—considering that we have to deal with HUMAN beings—not robots.
I would far rather someone “be the church” for me, instead of just “doing church.”
My .02 worth
bishopdave on Fri, December 02, 2005
Wonderful!! That’s my whole frustration with the critics around here. There’s only one message a church should have, but it’s delivery system needs to be adjusted for the culture. Just let your local church be who her Husband wants her to be and what your community needs you to be. Oh, and you might be emergent if you don’t get the point of this article.
Peter Hamm on Fri, December 02, 2005
Well… there IS only one right way to do church! And that is the way that will result in making disciples in the place where YOUR CHURCH is at, geographically, et cetera! So, find out what that way is and keep working with it and keep working on it! After all, Paul DID preach differently in different places. So did Jesus. Same message, different emphases, styles, et cetera…
And I think you might find fewer criticisms of this than you might expect, Todd, because of point #2. It’s a bit of a catch-all that should defuse a lot of criticism.
Evangelist Jeff on Fri, December 02, 2005
Great Post Todd. There is no wrong or right way to do it. Thank you..
bishopdave on Fri, December 02, 2005
Why are we so critical? Faith is at the root of our value system. For many of us, our faith includes what we are comfortable with. I have nothing agains liturgical worship, but I’m uncomfortable with it, for instance. This isn’t theology, this is about what I value in worship experience. For too many of us, faith includes style, how that faith is expressed.
These issues are very near and dear to our hearts. Attack my child, you attack me. When you insinuate my style is ineffective or otherwise invalid, you attack me. When you say our two styles can both serve the kindgom, I attack you cause then you’re saying my way isn’t the ultimate, God-ordained way.
When we served in Central America, our worship was different. What didn’t work there was when we tried to make USA churches out of Latin American indians. So, we adjusted.
I come from a faith background that is mighty suspicious of anything successful, and despite the example of Acts 2, anything big and successful MUST be watered down or whatever. “Why, if they were faithful like us, they would struggle like we do.” Do you guys ever suppose that some minsitries are big because they were given 10 talents by their Lord, and you were only given 5 or 1? Maybe I’m a 1 talent guy, but when my Lord asks an account of me all that matters is that I didn’t bury my 1 in a hole but instead invested it for Him.
Some of us are small-timers, and we are so jealous—till I learned some people can only be reached by a small-timer. And, that’s great. I preached recently in Acts 9 AFTER Paul’s conversion. Read about all the little people—Ananias, Judah, and who held the rope while Paul was lowered in a basket? Not much glory, but what a ministry that was! Let’s realize that your corner of the kingdom, however it is decorated, has value if it is faithful to the scriptures. And folks, the scriptures just aren’t a clear about style as most of you assume they are.
pdl on Fri, December 02, 2005
I don’t accept the premise of the central question posed here..ie. that we are called to “do church” at all. “Do church” suggests an event that man designs. “Church” is not something that we “do” it is something we “are”. The paradigm for it is the Book of Acts. The “do church” philosophy feels free to move out of the Biblical paradigm for “results” and “successful events”. When is the last time you on this blogh have discussed deep concerted times of prayer where the Holy Spirit infuses His power in the local church as THE basis for evangelism, winning the lost, missions and discipleship? It is always programs, ideas, gimmicks, trends, market surveys, fads, “try this/try that”...what a waste of time! What a sorry foundation on which to actually build the Kingdom of God! I won’t even deal with the question that Perry posted because I believe they represent a profound misconception of what the Church really is and how it is to operate in this world…great post though, because this really does get to the heart of this debate!
pdl
Todd on Fri, December 02, 2005
pdl: “It is always programs, ideas, gimmicks, trends, market surveys, fads, “try this/try that” [on this blog]...what a waste of time! What a sorry foundation on which to actually build the Kingdom of God!”
Why are you here, pdl? Seriously. If you think this is a waste of time and everything we do here is ‘sorry’, then, honestly… why are you here?
You see, if you don’t agree with much of anything here; and all you are able to do is object; then it’d be great for you to find a blog place ‘to call home’ (because this isn’t it!)
Not to sound harsh… but I wonder why some stick around.
The same in the church… there are some people that just stick around… they hate everything about the church… but they still come. And complain.
Todd
Todd
Kevin on Fri, December 02, 2005
I still don’t understand why Christians feel the need to bash other Christians. I agree with Perry that there is no right way to do church. PDL has one thing I can actually agree with. The church needs to quit doing church and start being the church. But criticizing other churches does not bring glory to God. If we disagree then pray for them.
We are naive to believe that we don’t need methods and programs to help us reach people. Too many people say they will just let the “Spirit” lead. Maybe the “Holy Spirit” sent the programs, Hybels, Warren and others to help us reach this generation.
Phil Hoover-Chicago on Fri, December 02, 2005
And the Holy Spirit can help us reach “every generation”—not just this one.
But we must depend on Him. We must get to the point of spiritual desperation—where we are desperate to experience His leading, His power, His anointing, and then we can see “every generation” reached for the glory of Christ.
Evangelist Jeff on Fri, December 02, 2005
Todd: The Lord has people like Pdl and others on this blog to fine tune us. I remember the story Joel Olsten told about the Cod being shipped all together with other Cod. But the customer’s started complaining about them tasting funny. So they found out the reason why is because the Cod would just set there while being shipped. So they placed Cat fish in the tank with them because they are natural enemies. This way the Cod always had to be on the move and this way it kept them fresh and made them taste better.
Now don’t read to much into this fellows. I love you all and do not count you as an enemy. You are my brother’s in Christ and I like it that we can agree to disagree. It has done my heart good talking with each of you. Do you know why? Because after the day is done I go home read the bible and study just like I use to. I had gotten out of the habit of doing that. I have learned that there have been things I was wrong on and things you have been wrong on. We are learning together. Boy this good preaching.
I love you all.. I have made new friends in Christ all over the U.S. and how sweet heaven is going to be one day when we all meet up together.
pdl on Fri, December 02, 2005
Kevin, Todd…
I stick around because I actually DO NOT hate the Church or other churches, but because I LOVE JESUS CHRIST AND HIS BODY!!!!!!!!! American churianity is sick! God did not send us a program to try! He sent us His Holy Spirit to DRIVE us and His WORD to steer us! I am enjoining all of us to get on our faces before God and get His fullness back into the Church. YES, I believe we have wholesale drifted from the paradigm and power of Acts! None of what we are “trying” (doing church) is seen in the Bible…buying gas (for recent example), driving the church by the purposes of man, making “seekers” out of sinners, marketing to demographics…this is all our “doing”. My point is: Where is any encouragement on this blog to fill our churches with prayer as THE impetus for “driving” the church? I have NEVER seen one post on prayer as trhe central focus of what takes place under the roof of the local church—not one! Yet that was THE driving force behind the Church at its inception! I’ll tell you from experience that it is much easier to call the church to get on board with a new program that to man their place in serious corporate discipleship driven prayer. Kevin, your comments prove my point…we cannot seem to believe that making seeking God in prayer a priority because our desire to rely on a program that we can manage…we don’t trust Acts 2 or 4 to be ours! Todd, do one post on prayer as the central focus of the Church with the goal of being filled with the power of the Holy Spirit and a call to walk in the apostolic and original paradigm of building the Kingdom of God through the preaching of God’s Word without the fear or favor of men…then I promise I’ll head off into cyberspeace never to be heard from again!
pdl
Kevin on Fri, December 02, 2005
PDL,
I agree prayer is essential! But criticizing Rick Warren, Andy Stanley, and Bill Hybels does not bring glory to God!
Evangelist Jeff on Fri, December 02, 2005
Let me ask everyone a question? Is there any that agree/disagree with the ministries of Chuck Swindol, Charles Stanley, or Dr. Daivd Jeremiah?
pdl on Fri, December 02, 2005
Kevin,
I am critizing their philosophy, not their person. I am doing so publicly because they are calling people publicly to join them in their error…this is bigger than personalities! I am each of these men you mention are great guys and well-intentioned Christians. I want God’s best for their lives…God knows my heart…but, I love Christ more than these and value His word over their ever changing man-centered “approaches” to what God has revealed clearly as His purpose/paradigm for the Church in this age.
pdl
Bill on Fri, December 02, 2005
Point #1 says: Healthy things grow—period. And NO ONE can make a BIBLICAL case for a church remaining small & not caring about the community in which it exists.
Bill: It is all in how you define small - but tell me Todd and others, by this definition of things it was a great error on Jesus part when He said he was the Bread of Life - because many disciples parted from Him after that teaching. He spoke the Truth and downsized His following.
What about Noah, a preacher of righteousness for 120 years who saw 0 conversions and witnessed the God driven execution of all but 8 of the entire population at that time - what then? Was Noah simply not using proper technique?
What about Acts 2 which closes with a very clear pronouncement that the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.
What about Jesus own words that Narrow is the road and few are them that find it? Does that paint a portrait of an enormous body of true believers or does it portray the opposite? Which is in line with the parable of the sower, the parable of the wheat and tares and His words that MANY are them who will come to Me on that Day and say to Me Lord Lord. Those to whom He will say “Depart from me, I NEVER knew you.” (Emphasis mine/origin His).
Having grown under the tutelage of a pastor who seeks God for leadership and hearkens to His call, rather than methods or programs, I have seen the fulfillment of God’s plan in our church which was never to grow our church, but rather to preserve a remnant and pave the way for another church to move in and transition our Pastor into a new phase of his ministry for God. I am saddened that many churches today would not even know what it is to wait on God, to listen for the guidance of God, to seek His face rather than some new trend or program or hot point of the day.
The right way to do church has never changed from the day of Pentecost to now - reverence for God, preaching His word and edifying the believers, worshipping Him in Spirit and in Truth and seeking to come together and be of one accord, rather than divided by selfish desires.
In Christ,
Bill
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