Driscoll: McLaren’s Ramadan Fasting Observance is “Insane at Best”
- Posted by: Todd
- Posted on: Tue, September 22, 2009
- Viewed 140
- (37) comments so far
FROM USA TODAY: Like Muslims worldwide, Ben Ries has refrained from food and drink from sunrise to sundown in an act of self-restraint during the Islamic holy month of Ramadan, which ends this weekend.
Each evening, the 31-year-old Ries joins Muslim families in a room above a hardware store in Bellingham, Wash., to find fellowship and break the fast with a handful of dates and a welcome glass of water.
Only Ries is not a Muslim. He is pastor of 70-member Sterling Drive Church of Christ and a self-described committed Christian who just a few weeks ago had to turn to Google to find a Muslim in his community.
Ries is among a small group of Christians who've joined well-known evangelical author and speaker Brian McLaren in observing a Ramadan fast, opening a new chapter in interfaith relations between two traditions often at odds.
To McLaren and his Christian and Muslim fasting partners, it's a neighborly gesture of solidarity that deepens their respective faiths and sends a message about finding peace and common ground.
But the project also has faced fierce criticism. Some evangelicals say that fasting alongside Muslims at Ramadan, however well-intentioned, is a dangerous blurring of the lines and runs contrary to Christianity.
McLaren, 53, is the godfather of the "emerging" or "emergent" church, a loose-knit movement that seeks to recover ancient Christian worship practices and, in some cases, question traditional evangelical theology.
While fasting is part of Christian tradition, it isn't exactly a widespread practice. Some college students from different faiths have started interfaith "Fast-A-Thons" during Ramadan to raise money to fight poverty. But that usually involves fasting for a day, not committing to an entire month.
In announcing his Ramadan fast plans on his blog last month, McLaren wrote, "We are not doing so in order to become Muslims: we are deeply committed Christians. But as Christians, we want to come close to our Muslim neighbors and to share this important part of life with them." The goal is to join Muslims in the observance as "a God-honoring expression of peace, fellowship and neighborliness," he wrote.
McLaren, a former pastor, said his Ramadan fast is also part of his post-9-11 worldview.
Albert Mohler, president of Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, said the idea of Christians fasting at Ramadan appears at first to be neighborly solidarity, but it's more than that.
"The logic of Islam is obedience and submission," Mohler said. "It's by following these practices that a Muslim demonstrates his obedience to the rule of the law through the Quran. For a Christian to do the same automatically implies a submission to the same rule. And beyond that, it's an explicit affirmation that this is a good and holy thing. From a New Testament perspective, it is not a good and holy thing."
Christians should have friendships with people of other faith, but engaging in other traditions' worship practices is problematic, said Mark Driscoll, lead preaching pastor at Mars Hill Church in Seattle. Driscoll said that in this case, Christians and Muslims fast for different purposes and do not worship the same God.
Christians observing a Ramadan fast is "insane at best ... Sad, tragic, horrific, misguided, dangerous, wrong," Driscoll said. "If Christians want to pray during Ramadan, they should pray not with Muslims but for Muslims — that Muslims would come to know Jesus. To pray with Muslims absolutely dishonors Jesus."
What do you think? Insane? Sad? Tragic? Wrong? or Helpful? Beneficial?
Todd
Comments
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Jerry Decker on Tue, September 22, 2009
For Brian Mclaren’s reasons and statement as to why he is celebrating Ramadan, as well as Doug Wilson’s comments on them, here is a link. http://www.dougwils.com/index.asp?Action=Anchor&CategoryID=1&BlogID=6869 I initially saw his decision as rather harmless, but his reasoning changed my mind.
jac1962 on Wed, September 23, 2009
Again McLaren displays an appalling lack of discernment - I simply cannot respect or commend the man in any way.
CS on Wed, September 23, 2009
Bobby:
“That being said, I�m also getting kind of tired of hearing his �heresy whistle� all the time. Sometimes it seems like he makes a way bigger deal over things than they need to be or should be. For me, the Shack is another case in point.”
Unless, of course, it’s the truth. In this case, Driscoll is right on; Brian McLaren is a heretic, and his following of fasting during Ramadan is another testimony to that. (The Shack is a heretical book, too, but that’s another topic for another thread.)
—
CS
fishon on Wed, September 23, 2009
I am trying to remember when Jesus fasted for and gave any legitimacy to ANY of the religions of his day?
Elijah, well that was no fast he particapated in in conjunction with the Baal worshippers on Carmel.
I have a friend who is Muslim. He would not ask or expect for me to particapate in Ramadan in any form. I am Christian and Ramadan is not.
fishon
patrick on Wed, September 23, 2009
Graeme & bobby - great thoughts. I think that’s a reasonable place to land.
jac1962 & CS - those are very strong words. In my humble opinion, I would be FAR more hesitant to use words like that about men like McLaren who would no doubt extend far more grace to you where you may differ theologically.
bobby on Wed, September 23, 2009
Yeah. I guess Jesus isn’t recorded as fasting with another religion. Of course, he also lived in a culture dominated by the Jewish worldview. And he definitely did some things that ticked off the pharisees.
And as long as we’re pointing out those heretics who take practices of other cultures and faiths and adapt them to enhance their own relationship with God and others, let’s not forget those horrible heathens who took a Pagan celebration in December and turned it into what we call Christmas today. Which is probably not even the time of year Christ was born. Or there were the heretics who used the practices of the spring solstice and combined it with the truth of the resurrection and then called it Easter, a word that comes from the name of a false God I believe.
Not sure I see a HUGE difference between this and participating in those festivals which you probably all observe today. Some difference, yes, but in principle, not a ton, IMO.
David Buckham on Wed, September 23, 2009
I love the word “heretic”. It makes me want to rush a castle with a pitchfork. Do I smell brimstone…?
Jerry Decker, I agree completely with you.
all about Christ,
David Buckham
Keith on Wed, September 23, 2009
Having lived 11 years in 2 different Muslim countries (the last 6 as a missionary), local Muslim-background believers (MBBs) that I knew and personally worked with generally did NOT observe Ramadan by fasting. Most of them ate & drank publicly in gratitude of being set free from a legalistic system. Islam in practice is a rules-oriented religion with no guarantee of salvation; Allah is recognized as being capricious. The MBBs I knew enjoyed many aspects of their culture but hated Islam itself. Those who did fast did so by personal choice not to earn salvation but to aid them while praying for the salvation of their loved ones and their nation.
So there you go.
Mark on Thu, September 24, 2009
Driscoll said: “Christians and Muslims fast for different purposes and do not worship the same God.”
Its statements like this that makes Christians look so ignorant. If you believe that God is real and that there is only one God then its impossible to worship different Gods. That’s a simple fact.
If, however, you confess that your religion is merely a story made up in your own mind to rationalize your own evil behavior then you can easily have as many Gods as there are people to worship them.
When will Christians wake up and realize that they didn’t invent God, they don’t own God and they don’t get to decide who else is a believer and who is not?
When you understand that there is only one God then you may be a true Christian. Mark Driscoll is clearly not a true Christian but a polytheist in Christian clothing. Just because he happens to hate all those other people of those other faiths and all those other “Gods” of those other faiths does not make him a believer in only one God. By claiming as he clearly did above that there are indeed multiple Gods to worship, he is merely a purveyor of popular fiction. Thus he is definitely NOT a Christian. Follow him at your own risk.
Peter Hamm on Thu, September 24, 2009
Mark,
You are, I believe, very much mis-understanding the meaning of what Driscoll said.
There is indeed only one God, but the inconsistencies between what different world religions teach about Him are such that it is unlikely at best (impossible imho) that different major world religions are all valid ways to Him. I’m sure that’s what Driscoll is really referencing when he says “gods”.
bobby on Thu, September 24, 2009
Hmm. Not so sure about that rationale either Mark. Someone needs to mentions that to God, too, who said something along the lines of, “You shall have no other gods before me.”
Brian L. on Thu, September 24, 2009
Scripture mentions false gods multiple times. This does not imply that they are really gods in the same sense as the Divine God Almighty of the Bible. It simply means that people worship deities that don’t actually exist, exist only in the forms of idols created by people, or Satan disguised as a divine being.
Driscoll and many others, including probably everyone else on the forum, use “gods” to mean anything or anyone that is worshiped besides the God of the Bible.
Not sure if I was very clear in all that…
David Buckham on Thu, September 24, 2009
Mark you are right. Christians didn’t invent God. He made us in His image. Christians don’t own God, much like my son doesn’t own me, but we belong to one another. Nor do Christians choose who worships God and who follows God (although you did say that Driscoll doesn’t follow Christ). But the Bible, which was given to us by God, lets us know what His followers will be doing and will be like.
We do not worship the same God as Muslims. Plain and simple. They deny Jesus Christ, God. I am pretty sure they deny the Holy Spirit as well. They follow what many Christians would call, a false representation of our God.
By the way, if according to your statement, you are a true Christian and believe in only one God, how can you say polytheism isn’t real and still be able to call Driscoll a polytheist. Maybe I missed something with what you were saying.
As for following Driscoll at your own risk. You are right again. We shouldn’t follow any man, just Jesus Christ. By the way, that is a message Driscoll preaches.
all about Christ,
David
Ronnie on Fri, September 25, 2009
I am living in Malaysia, a Muslim Majority country. Recently, a pastor suggested during Ramadhan to fast for the nation for peace and many well-known muslim figures joined in. Although it was just one day, the pastor (my peer in ministry) had connected with so many muslim friends. He is building bridges and making peace, using fasting (a Christian discipline as well) to accomplish it. Let us not keep farther and farther away from our Muslim friends (people created in the image of God), thus alienating them away from the gospel of truth. We pull them closer, build relationship, and trust, then by God’s grace, they can be won for Christ! Mark Driscoll, I learned so much from you from your books but this time, I disagree with you, bro!
rbud on Fri, September 25, 2009
The comments here are about what I’d expect. I don’t feel nearly as strongly about this as Driscoll and some of you. I think heretic, insane, horrific, are terribly strong words that speak as much to motive as to practice. But, I see no gainful point about this fast on two levels. (1) To practice the fast specifically for Ramadan presumes by its very appearance support and devotion to Ramadan and Islam, regardless of McLaren’s intentions. (2) To honor Ramadan and Islam in this way sends a confusing message to Muslims about Christianity, which might ultimately lead to fewer, not more, Christian converts, both by Muslims and others who would view McLaren’s participation.
As one poster stated, my non-Christian friends would not expect me to participate in their non-Christian practices, but our friendships and mutual respect remains intact just the same. For example, I have observed Hindu rituals at friends’ invitations, but they never expected me to actively participate, nor would I. I find the idea of it troubling, actually. I may fast at times, but not to honor Islam. In fact, my day to day goal is to do everything in a way that honors Christ alone. Operative word, “alone”.
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