Gays Are Really Mad These Days… and They’re Taking Their Protest to the Church
- Posted by: Todd
- Posted on: Tue, November 11, 2008
- Viewed 116
- (59) comments so far
Protesters also hit up Saddleback Church this week. They’re ticked there because Rick Warren was in support of Prop 8, which was a ban on gay marriage.
Here’s another great quote. What do you think of this one:
“I’m here because of the gay and lesbian children sitting in the pews now who are being told that being gay is not OK,” said Laura McFerrin, gesturing toward the church during Sunday’s protest. “I was like those kids. The hardest part of coming out as a lesbian is aligning your faith with who you are.”
I also like Cheetos and going to the lake on Sundays. I also like to drive, like, really really fast. Oh, and long walks on the beach. What’s wrong with ‘aligning my faith’ to those things? They are ‘who I am’.
Don’t worry… the protesters will be back next week. This is at least a two-part series at First Baptist.
Your thoughts?
About a hundred protesters stood outside First Baptist Dallas on Sunday protesting the sermon of the day: "Why Gay is Not OK".
My favorite quote from the Dallas News is from Patrick Hancock, who attended the protest: "Most of the people here are Christians, and they're taking offense at the Baptist Church trying to say how Christ's love should be interpreted.
They're taking offense at the church interpreting Christ? As John McCain would say, "My friend", the church has been doing that for centuries now... and you with your sign are attempting to do the very same thing...
Comments
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brandy on Tue, November 11, 2008
some of the people wanted to kill jesus for what he was teaching, i would say preacher put on your armour and keep preaching , maybe some of them will listen and understand, and come to jesus.
Peter Hamm on Tue, November 11, 2008
I would argue that the protesters are very interested in preserving freedom of speech, and that they want to be allowed to believe whatever they choose to believe…
...but if we think they’re wrong, we don’t have the right to say it or believe it?
This is what always tears me up on this kind of issue.
brandy on Tue, November 11, 2008
peter why is it always one sided, there right and the preacher is wrong in their eyes?
Peter Hamm on Tue, November 11, 2008
Well, what is more to the point is that they are protesting a religious organization (not a public one).
They want that organization to change its beliefs, in fact you might argue that they want the organization to change something that is at the very core of their beliefs, their belief in the authority and inspiration of Scripture.
Either that, or they just want to make headlines. I’m guessing that.
Brian L. on Tue, November 11, 2008
I’ve said for years that:
1. Tolerance used to mean “respecting someone in spite of the differences.” Now it means “trashing your own beliefs and convictions and embracing the things you disagree with.”
2. Tolerance is a one-way street. We are expected to tolerate those who disagree with us, but they are not expected to do the same. They are given free reign to denigrate and force us to change. Those who scream the loudest for tolerance are the quickest to deny it to those with whom they disagree.
Interesting that many of these people decry the hypocrisy they see in the church but are hypocritical themselves in the issue of tolerance.
CS on Tue, November 11, 2008
I’ve noticed that California’s Prop 8 really caused the GLBT community and supporters to go into overdrive recently. I have several friends on social networking sites, gay and straight alike, who are in a fervor over this passing, and they are calling for all sorts of things from changes in electioneering laws to removing the tax-exempt status from the Mormon church.
The fact remains that our God is a God of order and design, from the layout of the earth to the dimensions of the Arks. And there was a specific design to the way mankind should behave with itself, too. And as Christians, we believe that this order is best for mankind, and speak out against sin.
I’m with everyone else so far on this thread.
—
CS
Brent H on Tue, November 11, 2008
While I do not agree with the position of the protesters, I think the discussion of tolerance needs some clarification. I don’t think they are being hypocritical as some have charged. All groups, even ones that promote tolerance, feel that tolerance at some point has to be given up for the sake of the greater good. Think of the civil rights movement. Why couldn’t we just be tolerant of those who hated African-Americans and let them have their right to believe what they believe (many of them using the bible, albeit erroneously)?
The protestors feel that the rights being denied to them are an injustice so they speak out. We cannot ask them to tolerate something that they feel is an injustice. They see what we believe as an attack on their very being, and I could never ask someone to tolerate that.
Our task as the church is not to convince the protesters to be tolerant of our beliefs, but instead to show the love, grace, and community that changes lives. When they “slap our cheek”, we must turn the other. Vilifying them only seeks to widen the chasm that already exists between us.
Eric Joppa on Tue, November 11, 2008
I feel a little sorry for these people. not only are they severely deceived, they are confused about what took place last Tuesday.
Once the public votes to ratify a constitutional amendment it is done. No court, no lawsuit can overturn it. the constitution is hereby amended to include a definition of what marriage is.
Sorry guys, but this one is decided. You only hope is trying to get the state Assembly and Senate to table, discuss, vote, and place on a new election ballot a 3rd proposition regarding same-sex marriage. Not likely to happen any time soon.
-E
Brian L. on Tue, November 11, 2008
Brent H.,
I understand your point about perceived injustices. My point, however, is that having an opinion or conviction that opposes such things as gay marriage is seen as something that needs to be protested and silenced. Protests against churches are celebrated in the media. Opposing viewpoints are denigrated.
They say, “We want a dialog.” What they mean and practice is “You WILL change your opinions or we will force it upon you one way or the other.”
They want the freedom to speak their piece, but want churches and others to shut up. That’s what I see as hypocritical.
Wendi Hammond on Wed, November 12, 2008
Thanks Brent. I think your comparison to the civil rights movement is a fair one. The private [Christian] business owner might well have said “If you want to let those N—- eat at your restaurant, go ahead, but don’t deny my right to believe what I want to believe and as a private business owner, serve only Whites.” It’s true that the most militant in the G/L movement seem to have a one-way tolerance street, but when someone feels at their very core that a basic human right is being denied, that’s what happens.
And for those who’ve commented about Prop 8, as a Californian I must weigh in. The money spent on this individual state ballot measure (both sides) was topped only by the presidential campaign (the most expensive state ballot campaign in history). Much more was spent on the YES campaign than the NO (just to point out which side was most activist). Just imagine what we might have done with these funds in an area about which Jesus taught (since He never said a word about homosexual behavior).
Living through this made me sick. The greater part of the funds for YES came from Christians, Christian churches and the Mormon Church. The only way to get the undecided to their side of the issue was, IMO, rile up anger against people who are supposed to be our mission field.
I am a strong believer that it is not the church’s role to impose Christian behavior onto individuals in our INTENTIONALLY pluralistic society by creating laws that force non-Christians to live biblically (1 Cor 5:12). For this reason I was undecided about Prop 8 until I walked into the polling booth. Eventually I voted yes, because I believe it is appropriate for government to define marriage lest the slippery slope begin.
Wendi
CS on Wed, November 12, 2008
Wendi:
A few thoughts on your last comment:
“I think your comparison to the civil rights movement is a fair one. The private [Christian] business owner might well have said “If you want to let those N—- eat at your restaurant, go ahead, but don’t deny my right to believe what I want to believe and as a private business owner, serve only Whites.””
I know that Brent was the one who initiated this one, but from what I understand, the comparison of homosexuality to slavery and Jim Crow laws makes black people pretty mad. Their skin color is not something that could be determined to be a matter of choice or preference, nor could it be masked (like a gay person pretending to be straight).
“Just imagine what we might have done with these funds in an area about which Jesus taught (since He never said a word about homosexual behavior).”
While Jesus never said anything specifically about homosexuality that we have recorded through the Bible (“red-letter” texts), given that the Bible is all given of inspiration from God, Jesus did speak pretty clearly about His thoughts on homosexuality and what our responses should be towards them.
“I am a strong believer that it is not the church’s role to impose Christian behavior onto individuals in our INTENTIONALLY pluralistic society by creating laws that force non-Christians to live biblically (1 Cor 5:12).”
I agree, to some extent. Passing a law to force non-Christians to take communion would be absurd. But, we do pass laws that reflect our morals and virtues all the time, especially since our federalist republic allows for this sort of democratic action. And, when there are measures taking place that openly promote sin, such as prostitution in San Francisco or gambling in Colorado, we should vote in accordance with what our faith would prescribe.
—
CS
Brent H on Wed, November 12, 2008
If my post offended any african-americans, I apologize. I do stand by the comparison for this reason - the gay community feels it is being denied certain rights because of who they are as a person. Many homosexuals believe that they are genetically “born that way,” and therefore feel they cannot change it. Sure they can mask it, but let’s be honest, how often to we ask minorities to “mask” it by just acting more like we do. If they would just be more white, then racism wouldn’t be a problem, right? Our prejudices are rarely actually based on skin color, but instead on our cultural stereotypes of people of a certain race.
Again, I’m not saying the gay community is right, I’m only asking that we seek to understand where they are coming from and respond in love instead of getting defensive and crying hypocrisy.
Brent
Wendi Hammond on Wed, November 12, 2008
CS –
I hope that any black Americans who are reading this do not take offence at the comments Brent made and I agreed with. I agreed with Brent for the reasons he elaborated on in his subsequent post. Very often (some would content, generally) sexual preference issues are very complicated, hardly a simple issue of choice, as though every gay person simply decided one day after geometry class to be gay. We’ve all known people from Christian families who exhibited gay tendencies from a very young age, and then, surprise, turned out to be gay. These are people who believe at their core that their gayness is as much a part of their personhood as someone else’s blackness. Of course they believe Prop 8 violates a basic human right. Even Jim Crow laws allowed people to marry (as long as they didn’t fall in love with a white person).
When Paul told the people of Corinth that it was not their business to judge those on the outside, he wasn’t referring to their judgment about whether outsiders should take communion. In fact, he was discussing the very issue we’re discussing here, sexual sin. He told the people of Corinth to pay attention sin within the community of faith and stop worrying about the sinful behavior. I think he was describing a corporate “log-eye syndrome.” In fact, every word of admonishment from the apostle Paul regarding behavior was written (spoken) directly to Christians, not non-Christians.
I just wish we could get our panties out of a bunch over how pagans behave. People far from Jesus need redeeming grace, not behavior modification from Christian legislation.
Wendi
Alicia on Thu, November 13, 2008
“I also like Cheetos and going to the lake on Sundays…”
What a FINE example of Christian compassion you are showing in your comments. Your casual disregard for the pain and struggles of others shows what’s truly in your heart. Is what we see there a light that will bring others closer to God?
Donnie Miller on Thu, November 13, 2008
Wendi,
Your last two posts were excellent!
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