How do you measure Sermon Length?
- Posted by: Todd
- Posted on: Mon, January 25, 2010
- Viewed 1567
- (77) comments so far
What do you think of this quote: "Sermon length is not measured in minutes; it is measured in minutes-beyond-interest, in the amount of time the minister continues to preach after he has lost the interest of his hearers."
That's from a book entitled "Why Johnny Can't Preach" (by T. David Gordon). JD Greear shares this quote on his blog recently.
Gordon continues:
Some preaching is so bad that the best we can say about some preachers is that they themselves realize it, and are merciful in the length of their sermons (ouch!). By contrast, I've heard ministers whose sermons I was disappointed to have come to an end. These entire sermons had been so well delivered--so thoughtful, so faithful to the text without being pedantic... so well-organized as to appear seamless, so challenging and nourishing to my soul--that I just didn't want the experience to end."
What do YOU think? How do you measure the length of your sermons?
My 2 cents: Very few preachers have the communication skills to go over 30 minutes. Very few. Unless you're Andy Stanley, is it really necessary to take 50 minutes to bring home your point? (I realize this may open a can of worms, but seriously, most sermons would be 100x better if you wacked them in half. And the thing is... you don't have to cut that much content... just choose it more wisely. Am I wrong?)
Love to hear your comments...
Todd
Comments
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Anonymous on Wed, January 27, 2010
Peter,
I know the culture in which we minister… this is a sin-sick wicked culture… and the only medicine is God’s Word… the church isn’t to be seeker or pre-believer focused… but rather, the church is to be God focused… God said, if He be lifted up He’ll draw all men to Him… I believe this is one of the problems; the church has transferred her ecclesia status to inclusiveness… many are looking for programs, bands, media and drama to sooth wounds that needs spiritual operation. God’s preached Word is supposed to be the theme for our worship experience….
It’s easier and as well as an cop-out to suggest the cultures attention span isn’t long enough… our job is to train our congregations not amuse or entertain them… enough with these drive thru sermons and drive thru services…
Peter Hamm on Wed, January 27, 2010
Anonymous,
Yet another reason why I pray that you do not preach at a church like mine. Because I’m not sure you’re getting what I’m really saying.
I assure you that God is the focus here, and yet, we do respect the reduced 21st-century attention span of people, and as a result, I think that the Word actually sinks into their hearts and takes root more often than if we went on for 60 minutes or so.
I suggest to you that it isn’t a cop-out to know your audience’s attention span, it is a cop-out to ignore it.
Anonymous on Wed, January 27, 2010
Peter,
The danger in sermonette preaching is what I call the yo-yo effect. That is, the people are feeling good as long as they�re in the service but as soon as they leave and the devil gets on their trail they drift back into the same melancholy state in which they came in with. It�s not good enough to shout the people or emotionalize them� We�re to give our people the kind of preaching that when the organ isn�t present, when the band isn�t in sight, when the praise and worship team can�t be called on� they could draw back on the preached Word.
I wonder what would happen if your people came and only sat to hear the Word (no band, no music, no drama�just the Word. Will they come back or would they find the next show in town?) Too much focus is being spent on everything but the Word� I preached at many of congregations and I rather preach to a church in the Congo with Word thirsty, God seeking individuals� then to preach to those whom are looking for a show�
Psychologically it has been disproved the notion that the average attention span is 15 minutes�
Many are trying to lift man up instead of lifting God up� Peter I rather have to people leaving saying did not our hearts burn with the Word of God oppose to having them leave saying what a emotional good time we had� (I�m not suggesting ever preachment is to be hour long sermons�)
Peter Hamm on Wed, January 27, 2010
Anonymous writes [I preached at many of congregations and I rather preach to a church in the Congo with Word thirsty, God seeking individuals� then to preach to those whom are looking for a show�]
Again, you prove my point.
I’d rather preach to those who are looking for a show, because they need to hear God’s word even more. And I’d rather tell them the kinds of things that will matter to them where they are, like Jesus did, in a manner that they understand, again, like Jesus did. You obviously don’t want to preach to people who aren’t hungry for God’s word, so I suggest you avoid those situations as I implied earlier that you should.
I, however, will continue to “put on my show” and be all things to all men that some might be saved.
Rich Schmidt on Wed, January 27, 2010
Anonymous (nice name, btw) said:
“Worship and preaching is not something you just rush along so one could have their afternoon free. I�m afraid many preachers have to contend with worldliness and carnal minded individuals.”
1. I don’t rush. But I know my limits and those of my context. My goal certainly isn’t to give people a free afternoon. It’s to preach clearly, persuasively, and with an emphasis on responding positively to God.
2. I’m thrilled to “have to contend” with “carnal minded individuals” on Sunday mornings. Didn’t Jesus say, “It’s not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick”? I love that I have the opportunity to communicate God’s truth to them on Sundays.
Anonymous also said, “We�re to train our followers how to listen to sermons.”
Somehow I missed that instruction in Scripture. I thought we were to train people to obey all that Christ has commanded (Matt. 28:20). Big difference.
You seem to think that 15-35 minute preachers are all about giving people an “emotional good time.” That’s not what Sundays are about here at our church. It makes me wonder what your experiences with church have been, if that’s what you think…
Anonymous on Wed, January 27, 2010
Peter,
We have different views on what the pulpit is� I don�t believe the pulpit is a stage for man to showcase a show� but I believe the pulpit is the place where God�s Word is preached� I also believe there�s a time and place for everything� I believe in external as well as internal ministries that focus on reaching the lost� (For the record, a major part of my ministry is to the lost� I preach in prisons, half-way houses, shelters, hospitals, nursing homes, rehabs� so you�re hitting the wrong nail when you say I�m not focused on the lost)�
Rich,
You somehow missed my closing remarks� (I�m not suggesting every preachment is to be hour long sermons�) I�ve preached all types and lengths of sermons� and when I preach 15 minute sermons I feel like I robbed the people� that�s just me� It�s good to hear that your focus isn�t on emotionalism� I�m convicted if God is lifted up, He�ll do the drawing�
Would the people come back if your services just consisted and focused on the Word? No music, no bands, no singing, no drama; just God�s preached Word and prayer?
I pray we could all fellowship together�
Peter Hamm on Wed, January 27, 2010
Anonymous, I also “don�t believe the pulpit is a stage for man to showcase a show”, but sincerely believe you aren’t getting what I’m saying either, but that’s okay, since I don’t really know who or what you are. I probably shouldn’t engage further with an anonymous person.
In any case, you still said [I preached at many of congregations and I rather preach to a church in the Congo with Word thirsty, God seeking individuals� then to preach to those whom are looking for a show�], and that leads me to believe that you might not be interested in preaching a sermon that a “lost person” would most specifically respond to in the confines of a church.
We disagree on that, and I re-iterate that I hope you don’t preach at churches like mine.
Blessings,
Peter
Rich Schmidt on Wed, January 27, 2010
Anonymous,
Why would I invite people to a worship service in which all they would do is listen to me talk? In our church, worship includes singing, prayer, the celebration of communion, and opportunities for fellowship/mutual encouragement. If I did what you suggest, it would feel like emasculating or crippling an interactive, engaging worship experience.
Sorry, you included praying, too, in your hypothetical service. Still… I’m not sure why I would cripple the worship service in that way.
This whole conversation was started by a blog post that said perhaps we shouldn’t measure our sermon length by minutes on the clock but instead measure it by how engaged people are. I think that’s a helpful way to measure it, no matter who your audience is.
Anonymous on Wed, January 27, 2010
Peter,
Since I don’t really know who or what you are… wow, is a name that important to engage in conversation… who or what you are is a statement of offensiveness… I posted Anonymous because my name doesn’t matter…
You also ignored where I stated, (For the record, a major part of my ministry is to the lost� I preach in prisons, half-way houses, shelters, hospitals, nursing homes, rehabs� so you�re hitting the wrong nail when you say I�m not focused on the lost)�you’re cherry picking and ignoring a wealth of statements…
You just assumed I’m not focused on the lost…
Anonymous on Wed, January 27, 2010
Back to the topic of this post: We don’t measure sermon length… We’re not preaching our own messages we’re preaching God’s Word and He alone dictates the sermon.
Peter Hamm on Wed, January 27, 2010
Anonymous writes [You just assumed I�m not focused on the lost�]
no, I didn’t. i assumed that you’d rather preach to Word-thirsty, God-seeking individuals� then to preach to someone who isn’t.
Leonard on Wed, January 27, 2010
Anonymous, Names help us relate to people as we engage. When someone posts without one it makes comments harder gage. Is this a man, a woman, a pastor, someone who has been in ministry for a long time, a short time… Information helps communication. It is your choice to remain anonymous, but like Peter, it is more difficult for me to engage with someone who sits behind an anonymous label.
The church for some reason is especially fond of pitting things against each other that are really not or do not have to be. For example, Entertainment and depth… these are not exclusive to each other. Just because something is entertaining does not mean it lacks the power of God to change and transform. I want to be entertained and find that truth, well taught is both entertaining and deepens my friendship with Christ. Another is evangelism and Discipleship � these are two sides of the very same coin and often overlap. To pit them against each other is the trap of Satan.
El-Hajj Kareem Abdul on Thu, January 28, 2010
Anonymous,
I agree with your disposition. The Word has become entertaining instead of convicting. I was born and raised Muslim and had a great distaste of Christianity because of its showmanship. I was converted to Christianity under the leadership of a preacher who labored in the Word and excluded the excess. Many of preachers result to entertaining the people because they’re scared of teaching the Word. If you want to be apart of a show then consider joining the circus, Let Yah’s house be a house of prayer. As a Muslim I was used to sitting in the mosque listening to hour-two hour messages. We didn’t have choirs singing or the likes. We assembled to hear the message. I carried that same attitude over to Christianity. When I assemble at church I’m not assembled to be entertained, I’m assembled to hear a message from Yah.
Anonymous, I especially like your yo-yo illustration.
Let Yah dictate the length of the message not the people.
Leonard on Thu, January 28, 2010
El-Hajj Kareem Abdul,
Thanks for posting here on this matter. No offense but you were converted as it were because God the Holy Spirit used what was available to you at the moment. And no offense it is irrelevant to compare what is done in a mosque and what is done in churches.
I am glad you met Christ, I am glad you were found by Him. But again to pit being entertained against good preaching is a false argument.
El-Hajj Kareem Abdul on Thu, January 28, 2010
Leonard,
You’re absolutely right; my conversion was because of the Yah through the Parakletos Ruach haQodesh.
I wonder do many or preachers/pastors really understand what the unsaved, unchurched think about Christianity? As one that was on the outside looking in, I testify what they hunger for. The only thing that reaches the heart of men/women is the unadulterated Word of Yah. And one can’t put a time limit on that.
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