Ray Boltz: “I don’t believe God hates me anymore”
- Posted on May 25, 2010
- Viewed 3100 times
- (92) comments
Remember Ray Boltz? It's been nearly seven years since Ray 'came out of the closet' and took a hiatus from Christian Music...
But now Boltz is back with a new album, and a new belief. And a call for Christians to not discriminate against homosexuals.
Here is one of the lyrics to a song called "Who Would Jesus Love?"
Would He only love the ones
Who looked the same as me
Would He only offer hope
When He saw similarity
Would He leave the others waiting
Like a stranger at the gate
Would He discriminate.
Or, part of the lyrics of his song "Don't Tell Me Who To Love"
Don't tell me who to love,
Don't tell me who to kiss,
Don't tell me that there's something wrong,
Because I feel like this.
Maybe you're in love today and you've been making wedding plans
But there is someone in your way shouting things cause they don't understand
The judge says that's not legal, the preacher calls it a sin
Oh you just remember they were wrong before and they're wrong again
On his transformation, Boltz says: "I don’t believe God hates me anymore...I always thought if people knew the true me, they’d be disgusted, and that included God. But for all the doubts, there’s this new belief that God accepts me and created me, and there’s peace.”
Make no doubt about it... how the church responds to the issue of homosexuality will be one of the major issues in the church over the next decade.
What do you think? You can read more on Boltz in a New York Times article written recently here...
Todd
(PS -- I was never a big Ray Boltz fan. Ever. But take a short listen to the song linked above. Let's just say, the music itself would not make me a fan, ever. Not one of Boltz's best songs, gay or not gay.)
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fishon on Tue, May 25, 2010
When are real Christ Followers going to start obeying the Scriptures?
Jude 3,4———-4For certain men whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord. “
2 Tim. 3:1-5———1But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. 2People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, 4treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God� 5having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
————-Check out the last sentence——-
1 Tim. 1:18,19———18Timothy, my son, I give you this instruction in keeping with the prophecies once made about you, so that by following them you may fight the good fight, 19holding on to faith and a good conscience. Some have rejected these and so have shipwrecked their faith.
—————Scripture is true. Ray’s feeling are not the truth.
CS on Tue, May 25, 2010
Rick Garner:
“God cannot hate a person. He hates sin.”
How does Romans 9 fit into this, especially when it talks about Esau?
Brandon:
“Paul talks about the sin of men and women going against what is natural, for them.”
You added two words that the Bible does not include in Romans 1—“for them.”
—
CS
Rick Garner on Tue, May 25, 2010
CS,
It’s all about context here. Taken out of context it certainly sounds like God’s emotions are being applied but in context its clear this “hate” is about choosing and rejecting.
Many verses stand on their own very well. Others need to have their context considered. This is a challenge for me as well…while it may be easy to quote Scripture for certain situations or scenerios…is it truly in context or am I using Scripture to support my own opinion?
Check this for study: http://www.gotquestions.org/jacob-esau-love-hate.html
Brandon on Tue, May 25, 2010
@fishon: I’m having a difficult time trying to find where your comment fits in here. Care to expound?
Brandon on Tue, May 25, 2010
@CS:
“You added two words that the Bible does not include in Romans 1��for them.�
I did. For clarification. One of the meanings of the word ‘natural’ or ‘physis’ is:
a mode of feeling and acting which by long habit has become nature.
that is different for each person.
Peter Hamm on Tue, May 25, 2010
Brandon writes [Paul talks about the sin of men and women going against what is natural, for them.] Sorry, but as CS points out, that is CLASSIC eisogesis.
What if I feel very strongly that God made me a pederast? Then where would I be?
Brandon on Tue, May 25, 2010
@Peter Hamm. If God created you a pederast, you are loved exactly as you are created; a child of God.
As you progress on your journey, the Spirit will lead oyu. That’s not for me to determine for you.
Larry C on Tue, May 25, 2010
One cannot be free from bondage of sin when one continues to live in that same sin. One can live in that same sin until their conscience becomes seared and it becomes living in a state of the worst kind of deception.
Whether or not his sexuality is from birth or from choice ..... we all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. And we all have the choice to repent (which means turn away) of that sin. And, the Word promises victory over that sin. Would Jesus say to “Go and Sin No More” if He intended us to merely change the definition of an action from sin to non-sin? Greater is He that is in you than is in the world.
Brian L. on Tue, May 25, 2010
Peter, I was about to ask the same question in terms of child molestation (did God create me to do that or to have that desire?), murder, adultery, theft, etc. All of which, like homosexual activity, Scripture clearly defines as sin.
Brandon, I understand how you feel about the “natural, for them,” thing. However, the context of that passage is clearly homosexual activity, not “natural” feelings for the same sex.
Let me also say that you are one of most civil people I’ve ever met who disagrees with the majority here. That goes a long way. I’ve found that “tolerance” is a one-way street with the vast majority of those who think homosexual behavior is not sin. Those of us who disagree are expected to accept and even celebrate homosexuality, but ask them to give us the courtesy of wanting to hold on to our own beliefs, and we get ridiculed and called homophobic.
We may never agree on this issue - but I appreciate your tone.
fishon on Tue, May 25, 2010
Brandon,
It is simple.
There are godless men who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality. Ray Boltz is one of them. And so too are those who would declare homosexuality NOT sin. Boltz’s can declare his own ‘lego’ made biblical belief, but doesn’t make it the real deal.
5having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
————There comes a time when true believers need to STOP this debate with those who will not listen and continue to spread the lies of Satan. How many of you guys who believe that pedophilia is a sin would go on and on in a debate, with a pdeophile, who continued to purposefully turn scripture upside down to try and prove their position ? To strong, just insert drunk—rapist—drug addict. It is time to do as the Bible says with those who use the Bible, continually, to TEACH sin is not sin. ‘HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THEM.’
“Some have rejected these and so have shipwrecked their faith.”
—————-I would think I need not expound on.
Rick Frueh on Tue, May 25, 2010
Of course same succombing to same sex attractions are wrong. The Scriptures are clear, the physiology is geometric, and the reproduction is telling. But when someone can no longer stand the tension, and instead of going from one tension to another (denying Christ), he creates a personal safety zone which gives him a sense of peace but is fraught with deception.
But when Jesus says “lay not treasures upon earth for yourselves”, and heterosexual believers who desire to sanctify their savings and retirement accounts, as well as their stock portfolios, they relieve their tension by ignoring scores of New Testament Scriptures and incorporate their disobedience into a “God approved” theology.
My point is that many heterosexual stone throwers are manifesting the same “God’s blessing” deception about their sin as do men like Boltz. But since most of us have never struggled with same sex attractions, our self righteous vantage point makes gay believers an easy target. Let’s meet at the Outback for a steak and assure each other of our heterosexual orthodoxy and go home that night content with view of the moral law that must be adhered to before “grace” can be fully effective.
If no one can be saved if they are deceived about a sin they commit even while suggesting that sin is God’s blessing then no one is saved. Placing your hand over your heart and pledging allegiance that should be exclusively to Christ to an earthly nation is every bit a serious sin as gay sex. And many claim God blesses that idolatry. Put down the stones and retreat to the humble prayer closet that both inteceeds for Boltz and reveals the horror of our own sin.
fishon on Tue, May 25, 2010
Rick Frueh said::My point is that many heterosexual stone throwers are manifesting the same �God�s blessing� deception about their sin as do men like Boltz.
————Rick, what constitutes a “stone thrower,” in your opinion?————-Could it be something like: The acts of the sinful nature are obvious…I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this WILL NOT [caps mine] inherit the kingdom of God.”
Jim B. on Tue, May 25, 2010
To start, the belief that God creates homosexuality is a false premise. God did not create one to be homosexual. Granted, there are alot of psychological dynamics that go into the homosexual desires, but God isn’t the originator of them. Besides, if we start with God created me this way, then we have to change nothing about our behavior. God created me with a sin nature; therefore, I don’t have to stop lying, cheating, stealing, or commiting adultry; I was born that way. God loves me just as I am, so I am free to accept myself with my sin nature acting sinfully.
The second false premise is that homosexuals can’t change. This is also false; there has been alot written in the past decade regarding those who struggle with homosexuality being able to change that orientation, and this is coming from the field of psychology and not just pastors. I’ve personally worked with several men through the years that have found both spiritual and personal healing from their homosexual desires. So, to state that this is who I am and I can’t change is completely inaccurate.
In case anyone wants to debate my stated work with homosexuals, I hold a doctoral level degree in “Marriage and Family Therapy”, as well as a Master’s of Divinity in “Pastoral Psychology and Counseling.” I am also in a full-time private practice, so I’ve seen the transformations that have happen.
Besides, has anyone talked to Ray’s wife and kids? I’m sure they’re not so accepting of his new-found freedoms.
Peter Hamm on Tue, May 25, 2010
Brandon writes [If God created you a pederast, you are loved exactly as you are created; a child of God.
As you progress on your journey, the Spirit will lead oyu. That�s not for me to determine for you.]
Please think through the implications of that. You basically are saying that there isn’t a right-and-wrong that can be arrived at by scripture and plain reason. You may not mean this, but it is the obvious outcome of your argument.
Based on Scripture and plain reason, I have to utterly reject the notion that we can decide such things.
The arguments that the Bible doesn’t actually condemn homosexual behavior are based on revisionist thinking, mis-interpretation, ignoring key scriptures in favor of others, or simple rejection of the Bible as inspired at all. I, personally, can’t accept any of these things. He has, indeed, spoken through the prophets.
Geo. Brown on Tue, May 25, 2010
I understand fishon.
Everyone, why did God flood the earth? How many were saved? Why did God destroy Sodom and Gamorrah? How many were saved. What was the deal with the wife!? If the end times are going to be as the days of Noah (and MAN!... those days must have been REALLY bad) according to the wide and narrow gate and the many and few, just how many truly will be saved? The key element missing in many churches is OBEDIENCE. Obedience to WHAT? As fishon points out. The TRUTH. Sadly, many people want to disect it and reject it even though it is NON-NEGOTIABLE.
The apostle Paul said it best: “Wretched man that I am! Who will set me free from the body of this death?
Short answer- JESUS. The Way, the Truth and the LIFE! Amen.
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