The Tithing “Money-Back Guarantee”
- Posted by: Todd
- Posted on: Wed, April 06, 2005
- Viewed 116
- (55) comments so far
"I can remember when my children were little and my husband had just gone into business, and we had four children to feed," Smith said. "I went ahead and gave the money I could."
To encourage their congregation to tithe a full 10 percent, leaders at Gardendale Baptist Church recently challenged their members, including Smith, to tithe for a three-month period and in return, God would bless them. If not, a full refund would be provided.
Gardendale, on South Staples Street, is not the first church to offer a tithing challenge. Bay Area Fellowship on South Padre Island Drive also has offered a guaranteed tithing program during the past six years but plans to discontinue the money-back guarantee after one congregation member recently became disgruntled, said Bay Area Fellowship Pastor Bil Cornelius.
Cheryl Brooks, Bay Area Fellowship member and former employee, said the church owes her a refund of $21,000 for her contributions made during the past three years, the duration of her membership at the church.
Cornelius said his tithing challenge was only for three months, and the church never promised to return contributions spanning years. Despite the three-month time frame, he did offer Brooks a refund of her 2004 contributions totaling $2,694 to settle the dispute, which Brooks refused.
At Gardendale, administrative pastor John Gilbert said members accepting the challenge must fill out a commitment form, which acts as a contract requiring them to tithe a full 10 percent for three months. It is not until after the three-month period that one can request a refund.
Gilbert said the church has such strong faith in God's promise to bestow blessings that they are confident their members will not ask for refunds.
"God will bless you if you do what he asks you to do," Gilbert said. "At the end of the three months, if they don't feel they've been blessed, and they want their money back, they can have it. What we're trying to do here is not raise money, but what we're trying to do is grow people."
Texas Christian University religion professor Jim Atwood said that although he is not aware of churches offering money-back guarantees, churches are becoming more creative with their fund-raising efforts.
"There have been campaigns forever in religions," Atwood said. "One of the things churches are doing is looking for new ways to raise money to fund their ministries because they have more ministries now than in the past. The more services you have, the more money you need."
Churches have offered variations of tithing challenges with refund guarantees for years, but usually it's always accompanied with a requirement that members also adopt responsible financial principles, said pastor John Smith at First Family Church in Calallen.
"Most pastors will say if you will take all financial principles into place, then if you're not financially better off, they will refund your money," Smith said.
Smith, of Gardendale, who now plans to tithe 10 percent, knows that life is never certain, but she said tithing and her faith are constant.
"I think we grow as a Christian whenever we tithe," Smith said. "That's one of the things God wants you to do, and if you're obedient to him he will bless you."
Brooks said she will never again donate such a large portion of money to a single organization, but does plan to spread donations among several charities in smaller portions.
Any thoughts?
We thought it was a good idea” department… check out this article from the Corpus Christi Caller-Times. It seems that Bay Area Fellowship decided to offer a ‘money back guarantee’ on tithing to show that God WILL bless you when you tithe. It worked well, until a disgruntled member asked for her $21,000 back!
Comments
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Steve Hutto on Thu, April 07, 2005
Let’s don’t forget that tithing was a process Abraham was involved in, long before the Law came. Melchizidek (a type and shadow of Jesus) received tithes from Abraham and blessed him. Abraham’s tithe was from the “choicest” of the spoils. Aside from that, as a pastor, most of the people who come to me for financial counseling or even just prayer are not tithers.
From my own experience it works! My wife and I started tithing in 1979 as an act of faith. God did prove Himself and His Word faithful. After we started as an act of faith we continued as an act of obedience.
Churches are non-profit, and it does take faithful “donators” to accomplish the mission. It’s not about getting (even though from experience God will bless), but it’s about a heart of obedience.
bernie dehler on Thu, April 07, 2005
RLHand & Steve-
Abraham did not tithe. He gave a tenth of the spoils from war, one time, not every year. And he didn’t keep the other 90% for himself. You are confusing the word “tithe.” You want people to “tithe” like Abraham did? I don’t think so. God gave Moses the tithe command, and how to do it. Now you want to redefine tithe to mean what you want it to mean. Why not teach it as God did, if you want to follow it? Did you know that part of the command of tithing was to eat part of it in celebration? Do you do that also? Why not?
...Bernie
http://freegoodnews.blogspot.com
Steve Huto on Thu, April 07, 2005
Hey Bernie, thanks for your input man! But you can’t convince me not to “tithe the whole tithe” because it’s worked for me too long. I get too much joy out of it to stop it now! I never had to redefine the word tithe. It seems that He had it all set up for me when I got saved! All I had to do was trust and believe. I’ve seen the heart of God in this for too long to back out now! God bless Brother!
Daniel Zepeda on Thu, April 07, 2005
What most of us don’t understand is that the tithe enslaves us to giving a tenth of our increase. Once we give the tithe we are then freed to keep the rest for ourselves. When in reality all that we have belongs to the Lord. Once the tithe is given, our responsibility to God according to the current improper teaching of the tithe is complete and we no longer have any further responsibility and may spend the remaining 90% as we see fit. This is wrong and let me tell you why. As a Christian, you are no longer under the curse of the law but under grace. Being a steward of God of all your earthly possessions recognizes the fact that you really don’t own anything in this life. The tithe requires ten percent where stewardship requires meeting the needs of the body. Where as the tithe given is an act of obedience to the law, stewardship calls on the giver to be responsible to ensure that the needs of the body are met regardless of the amount. This is the essence of what Christ meant when he spoke harshly to the Pharisees Mathew 23:23 and Mark 12:28-34 The law working under punishment required the letter of the law to be fulfilled, whereas stewardship working under love strives to ensure justice, mercy and faith.
No one here is advocating not to give only to understand properly why we give.
RLHand on Thu, April 07, 2005
Thanks for the comments, but how can Abraham give a tenth (tithe) and not tithe? Spoils of war or weely paycheck, whats the difference? The tithe from those spoils were probably more than most people make total in a lifetime. Abraham wasn’t the only one who gave a tithe before the law. I agree that stewardship is at the core of this issue, but to ignore the standard that God set up is foolish. Again I remind you that the tithe is not a gift or offering, it is God’s. To give above and beyond is a true test of the heart, and its gratitude for what has been done for us. Even the secular world understands that there must be a standard, or else people, who are basically selfish, would never give anything that did not help them in some way. Thus the reason for taxes. God knew this as well, 80% of church goers don’t tithe, much less give anything above it. If you can get a person to tithe on a regular basis, you will have someone who is a good steward of all that God gives them. If you just say the tithe is not important, then you have dismissed something God mentioned several times in scripture as being important. I understand that you feel it is a bondage to the law issue. My take is that we don’t have to worry about the punishment of the law, for Christ paid its penalty for us, so to follow it isn’t about bondage it is about honor and respect for the standards God has given. If we are not to follow the principles in the law then lets go out and commit adultery, and idolatry, after all we are free from its bondage, right? Christ did not do away with the law, but came to release us from the punishment of death that it impossed for violations. If we were to stone every rebelious child, we would have all died long ago. It was the punishment that was done away with, not the principles given. I would love to see people give beyond the tithe, but lets be honest, most don’t even give a tithe. What is wrong with God’s plan? no matter when He gave it. You mentioned that a tithe releases people of the responsibilty of the 90% they get to keep, when in reality a proper attitude of what belongs to God causes us to be even more grateful and generous with what is left. The needs of the body are not being met, that is why we are discussing this, so whatever we are doing isn’t working. Maybe we are all wrong, and we need to fall on our faces before God and remind ourselves and others what we trully owe. Again I ask, how can you teach tithing without stewardship, or stewardship without tithing? That’s just the view from here.
Daniel Zepeda on Thu, April 07, 2005
Since the beginning of time God the Father had a plan to create man in his own image and to develop him in Christ Jesus. The Old Testament is a record of the intervention of God into the affairs of man as He sought a people after his own heart. Everything done in the Old Testament was done to prepare humanity for the coming of a better covenant in Jesus Christ our Lord. What God instituted in the law was a tool to show man his sinfulness and point to the need for a better covenant. The tithe was implemented to a people who had not known the Lord previously and it was meant to teach obedience, which has great reward. Prior to the law men did as they pleased and had not knowledge on how to worship God until Moses. Also the tithe was meant to be shared with the priesthood since they did not have a given inheritance. The principle of sowing and reaping, give and it will be given, are in fact intact in the New Testament in Christ our new covenant which is far better than the old. The best example of New Testament stewardship is found in Acts chapter 2: 42-47.
42They devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching and to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer. 43Everyone was filled with awe, and many wonders and miraculous signs were done by the apostles. 44All the believers were together and had everything in common. 45Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need. 46Every day they continued to meet together in the temple courts. They broke bread in their homes and ate together with glad and sincere hearts, 47praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved.
This is our highest calling in giving, which can only be attained as we abide in Christ. The tithe had its purpose in teaching obedience, but now we are called to a greater worship and fellowship in Christ Jesus our Lord. If we are going to take time to teach about giving, let us teach to the higher standard of giving as given in the example found in Acts chapter 2.
The problem is that the majority of Christians have not experienced a personal and intimate Christ as those described in Acts chapter 2. This is where our focus should be, teaching our church members how to enter into the presence of God and how to continually abide in Christ, which is the source of every inspiration to do and sacrifice for God.
Daniel
Ricky Roubique on Thu, April 07, 2005
Perry said:
“I have always found it incredibly interesting as a pastor to see that the people who seem to be most consistenly opposed to tithing are para church organizations.”
And I find it even more incredible that those who derive their income from an Old Testament command are so closed-minded to the Scriptures, particularly the New Testament.
As one who serves in the role of a “pastor” of an organization, I can tell you now that I fully believe and teach that the tithe is an OT command that has no place in the New Testament church. No “para-church” organization here, although it appears that such threatens the institutionalized church.
Perry further states:
“This is a debate that has existed for generations. I say go to Scripture, Jesus did not come to abolish the Law, but to fulfill it.”
Wow. This is amazing, especially in view of the fact that when the Church in Jerusalem sent a letter to the Church in Antioch regarding an attempt on the part of legalism to rear its ugly head (Acts 15:22-29), that the apostles and elders sent a letter stating that if the Antioch church would stay clear of just a few things they would “do well.” Interesting that no where in the letter are the Antioch Christians told that they should tithe.
Had the Jewish Christians (i.e., Jerusalem church) believed that by neglecting the tithe that God would “be robbed,” don’t you think they would have included instructions for the Antiochians to tithe?
Perry finally said:
“Someone said earlier that Jesus never tithed, let me point out that is an assumption. You might say that because there is no record of that in Scripture…
BUT…there is no reference to Jesus doing a lot of things in Scripture. Just because Scripture is silent on the issue does not mean Jesus didn’t do it.”
I believe the greater assumption lies with Perry who seems content on building a New Testament doctrine out of the screaming silence of Scripture. Sadly, that is all too frequently seen in “churches” today. The crafting of whole “thus saith the Lords” on nothing but assumption.
The tithe died on the cross with Jesus and His resurrection ushered in a new way of life: the Spirit-led life.
RLHand on Thu, April 07, 2005
Daniel, I agree and as I mentioned in both previous responses, it all starts with a proper view of God and what He has done for us. Believe me, I would much rather see a heart that is grateful and gives out of abundance without some % attached to it. Note: The tithe was instituted before the law on more than one occasion. If the law was the standard to show us how sinful we are and how far from God’s standard of holiness we are, and the tithe was part of that law, then what do we learn from it? We recongnize the moral absolutes of the law, why do we dismiss the financial ones? Most cannot even meet that simple standard of a tithe. I don’t really care what you call it, tithe, stewardship, spirit led giving, the fact still remains that most fall far short of God’s standard. Ricky, the passage in Acts did not say that they should stay away from idols themselves, just meat offered to them, so is idol worship ok? In fact that passage does not talk about giving at all or witnessing or meeting the needs of the poor or visiting the fatherless or widows. So we are to stay away from meat offered to idols, blood, and things strangled (there goes chicken), and fornication and that’s it. You said, “I fully believe and teach that the tithe is an OT command that has NO PLACE in the New Testament church.” Show me that in scripture, sounds like a “thus saith the Lord” to me. The tithe did not die on the cross, my punishment for sin did. I do agree that the law was completed on the cross in that we no longer have to worry if we have met every item and fulfilled every requirement. I don’t think we should burden people with a demand for them to tithe, they should give out of a willing heart and a joyful spirit. So how much does God require? nothing! It has all been taken care of. How much should we give? everything. It is the least we can do. Is the tithe a good place to start? Why not? Want to exceed the standards given in the law? By all means do so, it doesn’t mean that you are more spiritual than someone else who has only gotten to the tithing stage of obedience. The law is not my master, Jesus is. I don’t have to tithe, but I should, I should and then some. I am not a legalist, you can get to heaven without fulfilling any commandment except believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, but get that one right and get it good, and the rest won’t be such a problem. Even the tithe, stewardship, spirit led giving part. Malachi, after mentioning that Christ was the messenger of the covenant, said to bring the tithes into the storehouse to provide support for the house of God, and prove Him and see if by doing that He would not open the windows of heaven and poor out a blessing that cannot be contained. I will take His Word to be true and continue to tithe, and give beyond as is within my power. God has yet to fail me, and I don’t expect Him to.
RLHand on Thu, April 07, 2005
I don’t offer this as some kind of expert. I am just a humble servant of God who offers this opinion as what I have been able to establish in my heart and mind based on my study of scripture. Your articles made me think and I offer these to make you think as well. Believe me, I have far to go to understand the simple things of God, but I try to pursue Him everyday. He has the freedom to change my mind and heart, but that is His freedom not mine. I say, give. No matter how you define it, give. God loves a cheerful giver.
Tally on Fri, April 08, 2005
In the 24 posts above this one I haven’t read anything about the words ‘tithe’ and ‘offering’. I’ve heard a lot about whether we should “give” a tithe.
1. Scripture teaches us to BRING the tithe into the storehouse… It’s not about “Giving”.... it’s about “Bringing”.
2. Tithe is separate from the word offering. Tithe is the 10% and first-fruits. The offering is what we BRING or GIVE above and beyond. Some on this thread have argued that giving a tithe takes away from the concept of good stewardship and caring for those in need. They play the card of “I don’t want to tithe because it restricts me to just 10%. That is a bogus argument and the people who argue it know it. It sounds good but it’s not acted out.
Lets go back to Malachi because some of us forget to mention verse 6. We pick up conveniently at vs 7. I wonder why?
Ohh… there it is… he first sentence. “I the LORD do not change.”
6 “I the LORD do not change. So you, O descendants of Jacob, are not destroyed. 7 Ever since the time of your forefathers you have turned away from my decrees and have not kept them. Return to me, and I will return to you,” says the LORD Almighty.
“But you ask, ‘How are we to return?’ 8 “Will a man rob God? Yet you rob me.
“But you ask, ‘How do we rob you?’“In tithes and offerings. 9 You are under a curse-the whole nation of you-because you are robbing me. 10 Bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. Test me in this,” says the LORD Almighty, “and see if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and pour out so much blessing that you will not have room enough for it. 11 I will prevent pests from devouring your crops, and the vines in your fields will not cast their fruit,” says the LORD Almighty. 12 “Then all the nations will call you blessed, for yours will be a delightful land,” says the LORD Almighty. 13 “You have said harsh things against me,” says the LORD .“Yet you ask, ‘What have we said against you?’ 14 “You have said, ‘It is futile to serve God. What did we gain by carrying out his requirements and going about like mourners before the LORD Almighty? 15 But now we call the arrogant blessed. Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape.’ “ 16 Then those who feared the LORD talked with each other, and the LORD listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the LORD and honored his name.17 “They will be mine,” says the LORD Almighty, “in the day when I make up my treasured possession. [a] I will spare them, just as in compassion a man spares his son who serves him. 18 And you will again see the distinction between the righteous and the wicked, between those who serve God and those who do not.
It is apparent to me that we should understand the word tithe and the word offering before we argue whether we are to continue to tithe. We also have to remember that the “church” is not an organization. The “chruch” is in fact the gathering of God’s children. “The Body” remember? The way God blesses his Church is by blessing it’s people. The concept is simple. God blesses, we obey and we act as Jesus’ hands and feet on this earth (even with… no… especially with our finances).
Daniel Zepeda on Fri, April 08, 2005
RLHand said: “I say, give. No matter how you define it, give. God loves a cheerful giver.”
On this common ground one must agree and say Amen and Amen.
Lets us always be willing to share our opinions unafraid and to learn from one another in the spirit of brotherhood for our life and our actions will be judged by one greater than man, even the Lord Jesus the Christ.
Tally on Fri, April 08, 2005
Last thought:
Does anyone on this thread think about how that blessing happens? Some of you are so critical of a church saying “Honor God and see if you aren’t blessed” (Which by the way you will not find 1 statement from any of the churches mentioned that says the Pastors are name-it and claim it pastors. I know for a fact all three churches aren’t into that theology. I’ve been to two of the churches mentioned in the article and served on staff at one of them)
Another simple concept with regard to “See if God doesn’t bless you.” When a person actually starts to live on 80 or 90% of their income, they actually pay attention to their income. We in our country are saving at a -2% rate. You know what that means? Our church members and their friends are GAINING DEBT, not saving. When a person begins by giving first-fruits to God, they are forced to re-organize and set priorities in their life. The extra star bucks or donuts gets cut out… the extra car payment isn’t as exciting and all of a sudden people realize they may not need that extra 1000 square feet in a new house (with a new payment).
We all must get honest about this. Tithing blesses from a very practical perspective. We simply are forced to look at the books.
In addition, the New Testament mentions offering but not tithing BECAUSE many of the people converted (Jewish) were already giving the tithe. That was standard and expected for anyone following God. Offering is introduced as an ‘above’ mandatory principle. This is the answer to those arguing that the don’t want to be limited by a %. Good, you’re not. Give anything above 10% that you want… just don’t ignore “bringing” your first-fruits to the body collectively.
Have we ever thought that the argument of church/Para-church wouldn’t happen if the church body actually had funds to do the tasks at hand AND if we Pastors had the heart of some Para-church leaders to reach out, feed the hungry and clothe the naked?
Maybe we could learn a lot from one another and be stronger together than we are separate.
Daniel Zepeda on Fri, April 08, 2005
Dearest Tally,
Your argument is understandable, but extremely faulty in that in the statement you mentioned that “it sounds good but not acted out” is simplistic at best. This statement can be applied across the board to everything that God asks us to do including the tithe. Statistically only 20% of church goers tithe and I venture to say that those that do are usually the ones that give above the required 10%.
Let me give you another example for you to think on, Jesus said, “love one another” this too sounds good, but hardly acted out. Should we then stop striving to love simply because the majority doesn’t act it out?, of course not! We are commanded to strive to perfection in all things pertaining to Godliness. Stewardship of your life before God through Christ is more than just fulfilling the law.
Tally on Fri, April 08, 2005
Daniel,
Did you read my entire post or just enough to come up with a smart remark?
My post does not take away from the acting out of giving above 10% (an offering).
In fact my entire point is that 10% is the minimum God asks as basic obedience in the first-fruits area of our lives. Of course stewardship is more than that but NOT LESS. You proved my point while trying to put it down. Your correct statistic is a great example. The reality is that 20% at best tithe. So we can’t fool ourselves by saying Christianity as a whole shouldn’t look to the tithe as a standard because somehow Christ-followers will naturally live a life of overflow in their offerings. They won’t, we won’t. Let’s all be honest about that.
A little thing called our sinful nature prevents us from being a cheerful giver at times so we are in fact given floor of 10% that is simple obedience. (Similarly we are given a ‘floor’ in other areas of our life across the board which represent basic obedience.)
Remember: Obedience itself is a reflection of love, not the law.
1 John 5:1-3a
1Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well. 2This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands. 3This is love for God: to obey his commands.
Please do your best not to throw out Red Herring posts. Besides, my ‘argument’ had many more points than he one sentence you try to distort. I believe we both agree that the church of Christ statistically is too greedy and too burdened with frivilous spending to claim that we in church leadership are doing a good job teaching these concepts we talk about. Either that or we lie to ourselves by claiming how many people in the sound of our voice every week really have made Jesus the LORD of their life and not simply ‘savior’ with a lower-case ‘s’.
Daniel Zepeda on Fri, April 08, 2005
Nowhere in the New Testament are the people of God urged to give under a “mandatory principle”. We are to give freely not out of duty but out of love. Jesus said that the greatest commandment was : Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. Here in is great wisdom for those who have ears to hear. If we accomplish to TRULY love God and our fellow man then we will fulfill all the needs of the Body of Christ out of LOVE and not out of some “mandatory principle”. The whole purpose of freewill is that we choose to honor God out of love and not duty. I have included some scripture references for us to review and meditate on.
John 17:19
Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?
2 Corinthians 8
1And now, brothers, we want you to know about the grace that God has given the Macedonian churches. 2Out of the most severe trial, their overflowing joy and their extreme poverty welled up in rich generosity. 3For I testify that they gave as much as they were able, and even beyond their ability. Entirely on their own, 4they urgently pleaded with us for the privilege of sharing in this service to the saints. 5And they did not do as we expected, but they gave themselves first to the Lord and then to us in keeping with God’s will. 6So we urged Titus, since he had earlier made a beginning, to bring also to completion this act of grace on your part. 7But just as you excel in everything—in faith, in speech, in knowledge, in complete earnestness and in your love for us?—see that you also excel in this grace of giving.
8I am not commanding you, but I want to test the sincerity of your love by comparing it with the earnestness of others. 9For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, so that you through his poverty might become rich.
10And here is my advice about what is best for you in this matter: Last year you were the first not only to give but also to have the desire to do so. 11Now finish the work, so that your eager willingness to do it may be matched by your completion of it, according to your means. 12For if the willingness is there, the gift is acceptable according to what one has, not according to what he does not have.
13Our desire is not that others might be relieved while you are hard pressed, but that there might be equality. 14At the present time your plenty will supply what they need, so that in turn their plenty will supply what you need. Then there will be equality, 15as it is written: “He who gathered much did not have too much, and he who gathered little did not have too little.”?
16I thank God, who put into the heart of Titus the same concern I have for you. 17For Titus not only welcomed our appeal, but he is coming to you with much enthusiasm and on his own initiative. 18And we are sending along with him the brother who is praised by all the churches for his service to the gospel. 19What is more, he was chosen by the churches to accompany us as we carry the offering, which we administer in order to honor the Lord himself and to show our eagerness to help. 20We want to avoid any criticism of the way we administer this liberal gift. 21For we are taking pains to do what is right, not only in the eyes of the Lord but also in the eyes of men.
22In addition, we are sending with them our brother who has often proved to us in many ways that he is zealous, and now even more so because of his great confidence in you. 23As for Titus, he is my partner and fellow worker among you; as for our brothers, they are representatives of the churches and an honor to Christ. 24Therefore show these men the proof of your love and the reason for our pride in you, so that the churches can see it.
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