Bernie,

I am one of five pastors in a church of about 1000 people, growing all the time, and since we are SS, that means we have a lot of new believers and not-yet-believers here.

I am VERY busy in my job, and as such I do NOT have time to crusade against those you speak of, no matter how wacky they are. I’m too busy doing the positive work of the Gospel in my community, the true Gospel, the Gospel of grace, where sinful man meets God because of the blood of Christ. It’s what I’m called to do. I’ll leave it to you to crusade against them, if it is your calling and function. But I really don’t think it is everybody’s function to do that.

And by the way, our church is very much NOT dying, and that is because we focus on our function, we focus on reaching the person who is far from God with the message of God’s grace in Jesus Christ. God has made it clear to us that THAT is our purpose and our function, and we are very dedicated to it.

In fact, getting back to the original question, perhaps churches die because they lose sight of their function? their purpose? Any thoughts out there? And here’s another thought… Perhaps sometimes a church NEEDS to close its doors. Here’s a couple analogies. Eventually all the film processing places will go out of business because of the digital revolution. They had a purpose and function, but no longer. Someday, this planet will run out of oil. The refineries will shut down. They had a purpose and function, but no longer.

Perhaps some churches are not built to last, in that they are only able to reach a certain people-group that then dies out. If they close their doors, and another church in town is reaching the next generation, is that necessarily always a bad thing?

I’m not saying either way… I’m asking? Any thoughts on that?

A primary issue is that 1st World culture is changing.  Society is becoming more and more electronically connected and physically disconnected.  Even in third world countries where people lack clothing and cars- many have cell phones. People would rather sacrifice time to their online lives than the sweat and labor to maintain real world relationships.  This slippage into electronic life is frightening and as society slips so will the church.

People today have become coursened and impatient and therefore have little time for the slowpoke speed of real life interaction.  Kids join a church and then expect instantaneous change in themselves and others.  Then if the church responds in its predictable slow real world manner the kids quit.  Pastors expect the elderly to respond in the 21st century manner of right here right now.  The young fear tradition and the old fear change and it is the church that suffers.  The church once was a center for education and community- it has been replaced in many parts by the internet, wal mart, and the cell phone.  Elders were once mentors- and as such they were the wisdom of the youth and the youth were their strength- but this has become corrupted by the youth hungering for the elderly’s wealth and ridiculing the elder’s wisdom.  While the elderly make no time for the young- instead buying them off with money and toys rather than discipline and training.  And it is our pastors who most poignantly suffer- alone and distrusted by both sides.  So both worlds withdraw one to their church buildings the other to the coffee shops and internet chat rooms.

The problem isn’t so much what is the church doing wrong- but will it survive in a world where entertainment outranks even govt politics?  If the church then becomes just another venue of entertainment- will the numbers justify the means?

Churches really are changing but so is the world- I think the word is polarization. People are isolating themselves more and more- while communicating more and more electronically and I don’t know of an easy answer on how the church can respond.

But I do know that the church will survive- maybe not in it’s current form.  But God will keep His Church alive.

JB Skaggs

It is always amazing to me how many Christian leaders subscribe to the adage, “He that tooteth not his own horn, the same shall not be tooted.” It doen’t matter how busy we are with our positive message in a “large and growing ministry” (somehow that always needs to work its way into the conversation), we need to take the time to say something negative about the devastating doctrines that are pervading the modern church. Positive truth is often impossible to grasp apart from setting it in bold relief to the error surrounding it.

I’d be interested in hearing more about your ministry, Randy.

Todd

Todd,

I assume since my latest post here is the nearest “Randy” antecedent, it is my ministry you are interested in knowing more about. If you will send me your e mail address again, I will be happy to tell you what I have been involved in over the past 30 years. My ministry has primarily been one of Bible Teaching and now church planting.

Here’s the paradox.
We have a hard time defining a dead church, but other people don’t.  Except in areas that have very small stable populations, if a church isn’t growing it is exactly because something in it “smells dead” to those outside looking in.  People in this culture are largely attracted to things that are challenging, thriving, and growing. 
Well over half of the current church would seem to be dead in this sense.  I don’t think those we want to reach are just staying outside, I think they are actively running away from much of what the church in the US today is, or at least what it appears to be.  “They will know us by the love we have for one another” has never been more timely.
The bigger problem, or at least one that is harder to see, is the large dead churches.  I am very SS in my approach, really ST or PM even.  Most large or mega churches I have seen or been a part of in some way DEPEND on people growing spiritually and giving of themselves in more ways than financially.  People today need to serve and involve themselves in a greater cause, and we see this trend responded to both inside and outside the church.  The large, dead churches I speak of have been hinted at already in posts above.  TBN, faith movement churches, etc.  Lot of them out there, but attacking them is not the solution either.  That repels people from our real mission.  Let’s reach people in the best ways we can, stop the infighting, and let our light shine in such a way that those shining lights that don’t reflect Christ are simply outshone.  Put the spotlight on grace and the gospel, stop pointing it in each others eyes, and we’ll see the kingdom advance. 
Lost and broken people can not, will not, and should not join in a fight that isn’t theirs.  There is a real battle out there, and it does involve them, but that’s not what the dead churches, or many of the live ones even, have been really showing to the world.