I am looking forward to receiving this book and this discussion. I am now in the process of seeking God’s next place of service and have wrestled with how to deal with my current church. What do I do if someone asks if I am thinking of leaving? Should I begin any new initiatives here? So many good questions on this topic...I am really hoping the book and this board will provide some wisdom.

Well, my husband and I read this book review with interest, since we resigned from a ministry this past year.
Our comment right now is that it also depends on the maturity and integrity of the church body and/or board in how you can go about this transition.
This church has been hurt, and it hurt us to leave, but it has been used by God for His good in the body.  It was a wake up call - with the complete surprise of resignation!  More people have stepped forward to serve and teach than ever would have if we would have stayed or if we would have resigned “with so called integrity”.  Most people were not listening to the Word, nor watching and praying.  Now they are.

If you have a board of men who are disqualified, which was true here, they will not work with the pastor for a good transition.  Only one godly deacon knew of pastor’s plan to move on and encouraged it, for the sake of the body, not because he wanted it.  In fact he is still mourning our leaving and wanted it to be different.

In some ways, this process cannot be any different than in the business world with a job.  When you want to move on or up in a new job, one usually does so privately, until a new job is secured.  Ministry is different than a job, I know.  Wisdom is needed to determine God’s way of moving on.

My question is, if you had a board and congregation that would work graciously as you seek another ministry - why would you want to leave that fellowship??

When the man of God is preaching/teaching the Word of God consistently and clearly with application and the congregation, as well as the leaders of a church ignore and even appose that Word - it is time to move on. (we did that for 15 years!) And this kind of church would not have cooperated with an open discussion of transition.

Sadly many churches are just like the business world. If you let them know you are looking for another church or even that you believe God may be calling you to another church or ministry - they will make your life miserable. As a result you may have to leave before you even have somewhere else to go to. That is why so many pastors are forced to be “secret agent” pastors as the article refers to them. Give us a break! It is not a perfect world. We would like for it to be but we must protect our families and ourselves from some things.

Another way to look at the whole situation of the pastor who left suddenly is that it spared the church months of pain and lack of ministry prior to his leaving. I know a pastor (now deceased) who was at a very difficult church. He was called to another church, told the church he was at that he was leaving on a Sunday night and loaded up the U-Haul the next day and left. He did that because he knew the incredibly high price he would pay if he had told them very far in advance.

The pastorate for the majority of pastors is a difficult calling. They are not at wonderful loving churches. Their churches have imperfect people who react imperfectly when things do not go their way. There is something about the dynamic of some churches. Individually the people who make up the church are wonderful. However, as a whole they are very cold and in some cases even act in very mean spirited ways. I know because I have been there and have heard from so many others that have as well.

This whole thing about keeping this ministry move a secret bugs the heck out of me.  Really, when I as a pastor am supposed to have integrity, live authentically and speak truth, keeping secrets drives me crazy.  Really!  When I left the churchplant I was doing, I let peole know, I was not hacking it.  I let the board know I was looking and I let the leadership people in.  Of course they cut me loose and I am now without a ministry place, running out of money and turning off cable.  But I couldn’t live with myself knowing I wanted out and playing the game.  Preaching to people about truth while I was half in and half out was absolutely nuts.  So, now what?  Well at least I have my integrity.  I think the church today really needs to look at the whole “shepherd” term.  With Jesus being the “Good Shepherd” and pastors really worrying about the finances of leaving-- i.e., if I tell, what will happen?, needs to be called what we really are-- “Watchmen” thats right, I am the paid guy, leaving for a “new thing”.
I would rather be the watchman that the shepherd.  If Jesus is the “bread of Life” than why do people scream for “Feeding” from the human shepherd?  The whole thing needs to be relooked at.  I know so many good guys out of ministry today--

But I got off on a weird trai.  No doubt the ministry revovlving door needs to be straight.  I want to go, I’m looking, bye bye.  Is honesty the best policy?

The ideal is for a pastor to share his thoughts and possibility of another calling with his trusted leadership team, be it other staff members or elders.  In that ideal situation, everyone would talk through things and it would be a healthy exchange of communication.  However, I see the point in keeping it hush.  Why, may you ask?  That isn’t the ideal.  Because church leadership sometimes does not act the way they ought.  Church leadership in America has taken on many unhealthy corporate aspects.  Therefore, it has created a culture of some pastors fearing for the well-being of themselves and their family, not knowing how their leadership will react to certain news and issues.  I have seen pastors cut to help the bottom-line of the accounting ledger.  Then, turn around and ask the pastor who has received the news that they “are making a change” to tell the congregation that it was their own decision to resign, keeping quiet that they were fired.  On top of that scenario, a threat that if you do not comply, it will not go well for you or your family.  I have also scene church leadership act in ways that are illegal in handling their paid staff.  So, although the situation is not ideal, it is understandable.  There is little loyalty to employees (yes, pastors are employees!).  And, there is little loyalty from pastors to their churches.  We do not know how that all started in corporate America, but it is the hand we now deal with.

Maybe the last little diddy.... O.k., so the “pastor” comes on board to a new church--- where the people hired him so that they can learn, grow, and move forward in relationship with God.  The New Senior guy comes into a board situation that thinks “corporately” and sees the church as a “business”.  Now, how much can the pastor help to change that thinking?  By my experience and from what I read in the blogs of today and past--- not much.  In truth his influence is basically just to a few good men.  Preaching does not change much, people still come and go as the please, teaching doesn’t do much, the churh is still thinking “business” so what does the shepherd do?  Moves on.  There really is a problem today in the corporate church--The shepherd is almost a nill.  Sad, that we in the position to have integrity and authenticity are place in a vacume where we preach the company tune, play the company game and go home.  The term watchmen really should be looked at.

My take-- going out into the market place to find ministry.  Meanwhile still looking for the place that wants a watchman.

My husband, who is an assistant pastor, has actually been in this situation twice already, and we are actually in the same boat again.  Oh, how we wish we COULD be(and could HAVE BEEN) forth-coming with the pastor(s) about our desires!  The problem has not been that we WANT to be secretive, but that each pastor has had a very volatile personality - quick to blow up, quick to cut down, quick to cut you off, quick to misunderstand, and quick to correct without tact or love.  If we went to our pastor(s) and shared our heart’s desires, the chances are very high that we would be given 30 days or less to find a ministry.  While that’s an unrealistic timetable, as it often takes MONTHS to find a ministry, it’s a very real possibility.  Not one church we’ve been in thus far has given a procedure for dealing with this, so you’re in limbo about how to handle it.  When you don’t have a pastor you feel you can go to openly about lesser issues in the first place, it strikes great fear to approach a subject of this magnitude.  How CAN you tell your employer want to begin looking for a new job, and then hang around for an indefinite amount of time until the right ministry comes through?  Once the cat’s out of the bag, there is tremendous pressure on - after all, if you’re leaving, new staff has to be hired!  What if they find someone before you’ve found a position yourself?  What if we don’t find a ministry within the 30 days? In our case, outside of coaching sports and a short time of working as a courier for a national company, my husband’s entire work experience has been in ministry.  We have nothing to fall back on.  If we risk telling the pastor, we are completely at the mercy of his reaction.  Our method of secrecy is for the sake of self-preservation, not because we’re trying to ‘pull one over’ on anyone.  We wish we COULD talk about it, but we have no choice but to do things this way.  We have small children - where are we going to go?  More than anything, we wish that pastors would be more loving and open overall so that their staff would not be so fearful to approach them about things like this.  Our past and present experience has been/is that we either quietly go about finding and securing the next ministry, THEN inform the pastor of the moving date, or we first inform him of our plans to move, and potentially be forced to find a new job in 30 days.  Where is the balance between the two?

I AM a secret agent pastor, right now, and I don’t feel the least bit guilty or shameful about it. I have been to my Senior Pastor three times and my Executive Director three times about the demands and desires of the church vs my family’s need for additional income. They can’t deliver any more financial support, and I am not able to provide more than 55 hours of labor each week. They may be surprised in two weeks when I walk in a resign to take a church in another city, but they won’t be able to honestly say that they didn’t have some sense of my needs and desires. I feel sorry for the people that I share ministry and life with. They will think I left because of money, not knowing the amazing amount of pressure, expectations and demands coupled with no financial budget support, oppressive management and unrealistic expectations. That means the environment will continue for the next guy. Poor Sap. I hope he calls me.

heart already moved on,
Tom

Another great topic!

Thanks for the comment Jeff.  Telling or not telling the congregation about our plans has less to do with our integrity and more to do with wisdom.  A pastor in transition can keep or loose their integrity by both telling and keeping it a secret depending on the situation and how he handles it. 

I have been in ministry for 19 years and through four transitions.  Depending on the situation I have kept my plans quiet, shared them with only the Senior Pastor and Elders and shared them with the entire congregation.  The decision on how to approach each situation depended on a variety of factors including the needs of my family, the needs of the church and my relationship with the church leadership. 

Lest you think that I am just being political, you need to know that I also resigned from one position without having another ministry lined up because that was the best course for the church in that situation.

In addition, I have always maintained the personal polilcy to answer truthfully and directly when asked the question, “Are you looking.” This can be risky but I have found that those who have the sensitivity to ask are usually mature enough to handle the truth discreetly.

Sounds like Pete went about it wrong.  There’s nothing wrong with having a seperate life from Church, seperate email, etc.  But he shouldn’t have lied about “vacation.” He should just say it’s personal business.  He should still earn his pay where he’s currently working, too.  It’s not that there’s secrets, but the congregation doesn’t have to know EVERYTHING about him.

...Bernie
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/247

The first church I served was not a good fit for me or for my family, and we discovered this fact quite soon into our ministry.  I tried to serve them wholeheartedly, but after about a year I did begin seeking other churches.  I did not lie or deny my intentions, but neither did I broadcast them--until things got serious with another church.  This other church invited me down for an interview, and things seemed to go quite well.  Since it looked quite probable that I would be leaving to take this other ministry, I informed my board of the status of the situation and asked for their prayers.

The results were awful.  The other church decided to go with someone else--but two individuals from the church I was serving determined to oust me.  After all, if I were leaving anyway, why wait?  It took them another 4 months, but they finally got their way.  I then had no church--and no prospects, since I had spent my time trying to deal with the issues in the current church and had not put any effort into looking elsewhere during that time.

I have always tried to live openly and transparently--but in this matter of changing churches, I have ever since then been quite reluctant to speak to anyone candidly until all ducks were in their rows.

As a co-author of The Elephant in the Boardroom, I am heartened that this kind of discussion is being generated among pastors.  As consultants, Carolyn and I have seen scores of effective churches decimated by poorly planned or (usually) non-planned pastoral transitions.  Peter Drucker says that pastoral succession planning is one of the largest issues facing the American church today.  The first step is to begin to talk about it.

However, the conversation must include the other stakeholders in the process—lay leaders and boardmembers.  Space did not allow the full introduction to be printed...if it had the reader would have seen a mirrored dilemma going on in a Board member named Betty who ALSO was avoiding talking about the issue.  So here we have a relationship between two parties where there is an issue that is of critical importance to both of their futures and neither one can talk about it.  In any other relationship this would be a red flag.  But in the religious culture we have normalized it.

It is not accurate to say that this is an unfortunate but necessary concession to the business world.  At the executive level in the business world, succession planning is extremely common.  At General Electric, Jack Welch spent a year mentoring his successor before he left.  Great companies do succession planning for their leaders all the way up and down the line.  I am not saying that we should copy the business model in our succession planning but neither can we use the business world as an excuse not to do it.

This is not just a question of whether a pastor can tell the church when exploring a move.  It is a question of whether a church thinks prayerfully, thoughtfully, competently, and openly about how it wants to handle the most inevitable and strategic issue it will face...its next pastoral transition.  So let’s keep on talking!!

Russ Crabtree

Russ says:
“At the executive level in the business world, succession planning is extremely common.”

I don’t think this has anything to do with “succession planning.” That needs to be done whether a Pastor is seeking another position or not.  “Succession planning” is a form of discipleship; replicating ourselves.  Whether we want to move or not, there should be somebody groomed to take our position, or be competent to move into it, or have our work documented well so someone can take over.  The opposite of “succession planning"… is just dumb (it would be making your job as difficult as possible to follow, so it’s easier for you to keep your position).

I don’t see anything wrong with two staff members looking around for another position, and not talking about it.  They may both ultimately stick around for the long-haul.  Maybe looking around will refresh their vision and remind them of how good they have it.  They just need to make sure they do quality work while they look (and if so, why is it anyone else’s business?).

...Bernie
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/247