I understand the ruling for the pastor who was living with the partner.  I don’t understand how one can turn away a person wanting to seek God’s grace.  It is not up to us as humans to determine who is to be a part of a body of Christ.  That is the work of God.  I have to agree with the other person who stated that I thank God for churches like the United Church of Christ.

I think it’s impossible for a church claiming orthodox Biblical Christianity to allow a professing, practicing, and proud gay person to be clergy. 

And “membership” is different from attendance.  I personally wouldn’t want to be a “member” in a church where you allow those practicing a way of life in opposition to clear Biblical teaching to be “members” as well.  Love is not just saying “oh it’s okay for you to do what you want to do.” Love without truth isn’t love, if you ask me.

The issue of slavery (during the Civil War) split the major denominations (Baptist, Prebyterian, & Methodist), although some rejoined since.  Both sides appealed to the Bible.  Now it’s time for homosexuality.  This is a chance to seperate the wheat from the chaff… lukewarm to hot or cold.

...Bernie
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/247

RE: Judging
“I thought that was HIS job, not ours...”

Jesus wrote to the church in Laodicea and told them that because they were lukewarm He would spit them out… disgusting to Him…

He then gave an invitation to open the door to our hearts.  Scripture tells us to judge ourselves:

1 Corin. 11:
31But if we judged ourselves, we would not come under judgment. 32When we are judged by the Lord, we are being disciplined so that we will not be condemned with the world.

Yes, Jesus will seperate the wheat from the chaff, in that we can’t judge hearts, but we can judge actions… and take a stand for rightousness.

Hi Dave-

I think a big part of the problem is the lack of holiness in today’s churches.  How many ‘wink’ at pre-marital sex? Sex is all over our movies… and sex sells… Do pastors see r-rated movies? How we need to be bold and not afraid to be counter-culture, rather than trying to fit into the culture.  Part of the problem is the way the gospel is being preached… as an add-on to enhance your life, rather than a repent and be born-again message… we need to preach living by the spirit rather than the flesh…

...Bernie

Romans 8:2
because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death.

When God’s word is our standard things are so clear - I Tim. 3 and Titus 1 give clear requiremnts for those who desire to serve in the role of a pastor, we will be accountable to God for not sticking to these requirements.

Kevin, you write “You can quote other bible verses to me all you want - all that I know about Christianity teaches me to be ACCEPTING of all people everywhere.”

I agree with your statement, anyone is welcome in my church, no matter what their sin. I will accept them, even if I do not necessarily condone everything they do. I will not ask them to “clean up their act” first. I believe the Holy Spirit will work that in their life. I will point them toward Christ, and toward His word, and I’ll be there to answer questions along the way.

But if a Christian LEADER is living in what the Bible calls sin, and does so publicly, claiming that it is not in fact sin, then that leader is indicating that they do not put stock in the authority and inspiration of Scripture. In this case, I actually don’t think the fact that she is a lesbian is what disqualifies her! Her open practice of a life-relationship that runs contrary to the word of God, and more specifically, the inescapable conclusion that she therefore considers parts of the Bible to be in error, is the issue. (If my senior pastor stands up this Sunday and states that he has thought about it, and the books of James and Jude need to be removed from the Bible, then our church is going to make that an immediate issue and act!)

If someone is “living in sin” publicly in ministry, it may be possible to restore that person, in fact it would be the preferable course of action, but if a person is saying that the Word of God is false, as is often the obvious issue in cases like this, then officially removing them from leadership simply confirms that they have ALREADY (de facto) removed THEMSELVES from Christian leadership. There are many “negotiables” in the Christian faith. The authority and inspiration of Scripture are not among them.

For consideration, I offer this quote from a few years back from V.Gene Robinson, the openly practicing gay ECUSA bishop of New Hampshire, which I include word-for-word from his mouth.

“Just simply to say that it goes against tradition and the teaching of the church and Scripture does not necessarily make it wrong, We worship a living God, and that living God leads us into truth.”

Well, then what exactly DOES make something wrong?

I thank the True and Living God for the number of people He has brought to this blog over the last 5 months or so, who are willing to stand for Truth, no matter what others think, say or perceive.

I encourage those that believe homosexuality is not wrong (sinful) according to Scripture, to take the time and consider Who God Is.  His Charachter and Nature have not changed (nor will they).

There are MANY ways which seem right to man BUT.....

I am a strong believer that God is also for the gays and lesbians. He died on the cross for them, just as He did for everyone. If my Pastor was involved in a relationship outside of marriage, he is no longer qualified to preach until the sin is repented of. Yes, it is a sin to live with someone outside of marriage, even for gay and lesbians. So, the same goes for gays and lesbians who want to be preachers and still live outside of marriage with their lover. If I was a Pastor of a church yet still living in sin, what example am I setting. Of course we all have sin in our lives, but we should always be repenting. If someone believes that what they are doing is right despite the Bible saying the opposite, that person should not be in a role of leadership within the church. It’s not about who the person is but about their life style that goes against what God tells us. Thieves should not be preaching, liers shouldn’t be preachering, murderers, slanders, and so on. Those who are living together outside of marriage are living in sin. Gay, lesbian, or straight. It’s not about discriminating against gays and lesbians. They are no different than the rest of us and God loves them all the same. Taking a leadership role in a church is a very serious thing, and it should be taken very serious. Those who are leaders will be accountable. Only those who are morally and spiritually sound in the word of God should be allowed to lead. The church is for sinners, and whenever a sinner is denied access to a church, the church will be accountable for that persons blood. Our church welcomes all kinds of sinners. In fact, our church is filled with them. They however, know that they are sinners and repent of there sins in order to keep the relationship between them and God alive.
I know of a christian man who lived a gay lifestyle. One day God touched his heart, and he surrendered his life to Jesus Christ. He knew right away that he was living in sin. When he approached the cross with all his sins, worry, concerns, and fears, God lifted them all from his shoulders. He was no longer guilty. Like many other christians out there, he struggled with temptation, and would occasionally fall. But, he would always get on his knees and pray for forgiveness. As most of us know sin can sometimes be hard to turn away from. This man that I speak about is a very strong devoted Christian. He doesn’t have a label on him saying, I’m Gay! No, instead, he has a label on him that says, “God’s Property. Bought and paid for by the blood of Jesus Christ. Who dares to deny that before God. Be very careful how we judge, for the same way we judge others God will judge us. Sin is sin no matter the name given to it. All sin is equal. No sin is greater than another. The christian who occasionally tells a white lie is no better than a Christian who struggles with gay tendencies.