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Why Jack Hayford Doesn’t Set Goals

Orginally published on Thursday, September 15, 2005 at 8:57 AM
by Todd Rhoades

I found an interesting article by Jack Hayford over at BuildingChurchLeaders.com where Jack talks about how he never set goals while at Church on the Way.  I found this interesting.  Here are some of the quotes I thought you might enjoy…

"We never set goals?that is, in the sense of numerical targets, fund-raising drives, or enlargement campaigns. Our one goal is to build big people. Every effort goes into developing each believer in the threefold ministry of worship, fellowship, and stewardship of the gospel."

"From the time I came to the Van Nuys church 15 years ago, I virtually abandoned the church methodology I had used the previous thirteen years. I knew the quotes ("Aim at nothing, and you'll hit it," "No vision, no victories," "Plan your work, then work your plan") and I knew the ropes (zeal, promotion, enlistment, persuasion, training, projecting, enthusing, inspiring, recruiting, educating, etc., etc.). The quotes held an obvious element of wisdom, and the plain work of developing goals and generating means and personnel to fulfill them is a very practical way to get jobs done?naturally speaking.  But it was at that juncture?the natural?that something inside me began to creak under the weight of the years."

"The general advantage of goal-setting, as I understand it, is that it enables both the pursuit of ideals and the measurement of progress. I would not criticize either ideals or progress, for the Word of God endorses both.  The problem arises, however, when we take this philosophy into church life. Without realizing it, our goals become numerical: so many workers trained, classes conducted, decisions registered, dollars given, missions begun, results tabulated. That is the way goals are verified.  It is hard to write about this, because in no way would I devalue any of the above ministries. But given enough time, something sinister often invades, and the goals begin to haunt their makers. If we reach the goal, we conclude that "God is blessing." The next assumption is "God is in this program," and before long we are serving the program instead of the Lord himself. People and institutions begin to corrode when fleshly zeal is tied to spiritual goals. We pastors have a propensity for launching our crusades with righteous intent and then fueling them with carnal energy."

FOR DISCUSSION:  Any thoughts?  Do you set goals?  How do you make sure that you don't fuel them with 'carnal energy'?


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  There are 13 Comments:

  • Posted by
    Thursday, September 15, 2005 at 10:20 AM

    I just read the entire article and found it to be most encouraging.  I think Jack Hayford exemplifies incredible wisdom and discernment that flows out of what seems to be intimacy with Jesus.

    And I love the fact that he’s not some young punk (like me) who is all for shaking things up just because...he’s seasoned and experienced in a variety of contexts and brings those things to the table in the local church.

    The result seems to be powerful.

  • Posted by
    Thursday, September 15, 2005 at 11:58 AM

    What a well written article.  Amen Brother Hayford.

    The people in Hayward’s church will grow beyond measurability.  They will (hopefully sound doctrine is being taught too) produce greater results than any engineered program for progress.  They will grow in the Grace and Knowledge of Jesus Christ.

    Somehow, in America, we’ve become the first church of Martha.  Being all about the work (ministry, service, program, etc.) and not about the Man, The God, The Spirit and His Glory; His Harvest.

    Can we truly measure if these programs are progressing The Gospel?  Sure.  Divorce is equal to or greater in percentage in the church than in the carnal world.
    One out of every two male parishoners view ########### regularly.
    One out of every three pastors view ########### regularly.
    Todd is able to find at least one article a week about “a pastor gone bad” or “congregation splitting over”.

    But here is a test we can all use in our own churches and with our own staff:
    What is THE Gospel?
    What does it mean to Worship God?
    What is Biblical Fellowship?
    What is Hope?
    What is Justification?

    If the staff is getting these things wrong, how great is this wrong?
    If the parishoners are getting these wrong, the we’re not discipling.

    Take a moment Pastor and on Sunday morning, Sunday night, Wednesday evening, pop in for 5 or 10 minutes on the “programs” (try to hit 3 or 4 each session) taking place in your church (or better yet, visit with the leaders for 30 minutes some Saturday morning) and ask these basic questions (imagine asking questions like: What is Faith, Salvation, Belief, etc).

    You’ll be surprised how many #1 Leaders don’t really know #2 how many/most or all don’t know in the pews, taking the programs and #3 hopefully come to realize that we’ve failed: Using programs (like the Purpose Driven Life) to replace our DUTY to take time and make disciples (actually take time and train those who God brings us).

    We’ll all realize that we spend more time seaking to save that which is lost while doing nothing to care for TRULY training those that are saved.

    Learn Salvation, Faith, Hope, Love, Sovereignty (I suggest you start with Sovereignty).  Teach others these things and grow in the Grace and Knowledge of Jesus Christ.

  • Posted by Brian Burkett
    Thursday, September 15, 2005 at 2:52 PM

    Amen! I was recently away in Evansville, Indiana for the simulcast of the WCA Leadership Summit, and my wife’s home church Senior Pastor from Christian Fellowship Church http://onlinecfc.com told me that he has never set numerical goals for that church.

    While they have very well put together seeker-friendly services on Sunday, what that church is truly passionate about is ministry in the community and discipleship. Pastor David was telling me that his belief is that if the church is healthy, it will grow naturally. He believes churches become healthy through discipleship and ministry in the community.

    And, that’s a church of about 3000 people. It was nice to hear a megachurch pastor say that he really doesn’t focus on numbers. He said that the numbers mean nothing if it doesn’t mean truly transformed lives.

    Amen!

    Beneath His Mercy,
    Brian

    http://brianburkett.blogspot.com

  • Posted by
    Friday, September 16, 2005 at 10:09 AM

    What a refreshing change from all the post modern new hollywood religion that is neither Biblical or uplifting to the spirit.

    Now I know why Jack Hayford was one of only a few --one or two-- ministers who could reach me when I was bound by oppressive spirits.  Only the real thing works.

  • Posted by Bernie Dehler
    Friday, September 16, 2005 at 12:09 PM

    Great insights into the problem with many churches today,,, doing the work of religion in the flesh.

    However, let me share a quote that I heard and really like: “You get what you measure.” The key is to measure the right things.  Not church attendance, but spiritual growth.  The problem is, how do you measure it? Maybe it’s very subjective, or we have to be very creative. 

    Todd, it’s refreshing to see you move more in this spiritual direction now… at least by sharing that article with the modern day abuses that are being promoted by Christian leaders today.

    ...Bernie
    http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/247

  • Posted by
    Friday, September 16, 2005 at 12:53 PM

    ["You get what you measure.” The key is to measure the right things. Not church attendance, but spiritual growth. The problem is, how do you measure it?]

    I suggest a couple of ways to measure spiritual growth are; when people are reading their Bibles and studying the Word on their own AND when a multitude of questions come like “what book should I buy in studying this book of The Bible” or “what do you think about this view pastor”.

    Also, you’ll see spiritual growth when people are testing beliefs and teachings (doctrines) and able to exhort one another in all things (only TRUE friends can do this without offense)out of love for God.

    Most of all, when we hold other people higher than ourselves as evidence the Spirit is working in our lives.

  • Posted by Joe Miller
    Friday, September 16, 2005 at 6:38 PM

    A pastor with whom I formerly served once made a comment about a large church in the south.  That church has tens of thousands of folks attending and his summary of the ministry was this, “he must be doing something right”.  The challange for me in that thinking is the assumption that if you have a lot of folks, then y9ou must be doing God’s work.  Mr. Hayford’s analysis is right on and I think his remarrks need to be taken a bit more seriously by many churches.  We can accomplish much by the will and work of the flesh; meet our goals and create great visisions.  But this mixed up Puritan theology of success=blessing is not a good one for us to follow.

    As pointed out in in this blog, if the standard lgoic were true, we must all conclude that “Marilyn Manson is Doing God’s Work!”

    http://www.emerginglife.org/chat/weblog_entry.php?e=26

    ---------
    visit me @ http://www.emerginglife.org

  • Posted by Joe Miller
    Saturday, September 17, 2005 at 12:26 AM

    The irony of this article just hit me.  Would we be listening to Hayford if he were the pastor of a church of 100? 

    Pleasue understand, I am not being critical of Hayford, or his comments.. I am just trying to turn his criticism inward and aks myself.. do I agree with his comments in theory, but only listen becuase of his external success?

  • Posted by
    Monday, September 19, 2005 at 11:35 AM

    To both the article by Jack Hayford, and to the wonderful post, just previously, by Joe Miller,

    Yes, it is the spiritual values that make a Church big AND good, isn’t it?  In the end, God evaluates wood, hay, stubble, gold, silver, precious jewels ...  smile His values, eventually, do rule.

    I lived in Los Angeles for 25 years, and went to the other big church in the area, which I love.  One example of how Hayford’s church lived what he is saying in this article is that they empowered people in their musical skills to use their gifts in the services - not just the star system, or the carefully controlled few.  But everyone got groomed to the level of their skills and gifting, it seemed.  That church birthed more excellent musical ministries than any other church I’ve ever heard of.  And I listen for these kinds of things. 

    I can ony think that the same might be true in other ares of his church.  The values and character of the ultimate leader do shape the entire organization, gradually, and cannot be stopped.

    So, Amen to brother Jack!  And good insight from Brother Joe, too!

    William

  • Posted by
    Monday, September 19, 2005 at 2:48 PM

    Hayford says, “Given enough time, something sinister often invades, and the goals begin to haunt their makers.” So true! It is an easy and often subtle slide into well-intentioned goals becoming the god we serve, setting us up to be driven perfectionists who fear becoming frustrated failures.

    On the other hand, setting no goals can also become an excuse for doing nothing, and patting ourselves on the back for doing nothing. Sadly, there are lazy, unimaginative, complacent pastors who will use the lack of goals as their excuse and their “pillow.”

    It is not “setting goals” that is the problem. It is the sin within us, which finds a way to work with or without goal setting.

    Goals must be set only in the context of prayer, seeking God’s goals rather than our own, and pursued the same way.

  • Posted by
    Thursday, September 22, 2005 at 12:43 PM

    I have so much respect for Pastor Jack. My wife and I have been a part of an arm of Church on Way (Cleansing Streams)for the past three years. Every time Pastor Jack would address the group, there was wisdom, deep love and concern and above all else, we walked away changed. He is so right on in his comments. I’m not young, and I’m not real old yet, but I feel the weight of programs, evaluations, success after success. I’m just plain tired. Pastor Jack’s comments confirm in my spirit what I’ve been sensing for quite some time that I have to be about something higher and deeper than just numbers, success, and always working toward the next event. It’s so easy to lose the joy of just ministering with Jesus when we only look for the markers to confirm what we’re doing is right. Thanks for posting his article.

  • Posted by
    Thursday, September 22, 2005 at 1:24 PM

    Thank You Dr Hayford for imparting great wisdom that is balanced and grounded in the eternal Word of God.

    There are no arguments.

  • Posted by
    Monday, September 26, 2005 at 1:37 PM

    WHAT WISDOM! IT ONLY BEGINS WHEN WE AS CHRIST MEN AND WOMEN FIND THAT IT ALL BEGINS WITH LOVE WORKING OUR FAITH AND THAT FAITH BUILDING ON LOVE THAT GIVES US THE TRUTH THAT ITS CHRIST IN US THE HOPE OF GLORY. EMPHISIS ON HOPE, WHEN WE GET TOGEATHER WE SHARE OUR HOPE (DREAMS) WITH EACH OTHER, IF ALLOWED TO DO SO, IF NOT HOPE IS DEFERRED AND THE HEART GETS SICK. THANKS BROTHER JACK FOR THE HOPE THAT DREAMS ARE MADE OF. JESUS LOVES YOU AND SO DO I TIM COOPER

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