Group Opposed to Bellevue Leadership Forms a Board of Directors
- Posted by: Todd
- Posted on: Mon, January 29, 2007
- Viewed 159
- (66) comments so far
We’ve talked about the Bellevue situation numerous times (here, here, and here) at MMI. We’ve also talked about the growing propencity of people to air their grievances with church leadership over the web through websites and blogs.
Again, someone ups the stakes with an official, chartered group within a church taking their fight for ‘integrity’ public. How will churches deal with individuals who feel “compelled to sound its voice, take necessary measures, and use all available resources for seeking the truth concerning questionable events and actions”
Admirable goals, I guess. But to do so publically… I’m not sure.
More from their website:
Integrity Does Count, Inc., (IDC) consisting entirely of Bellevue Baptist Church (BBC) members, announces its charter and aims to bring truth to both the unanswered questions as well as to the non-disclosed facts and records of the current administration. Members of IDC, Inc. have been carefully following the events as they have occurred over the past 18 months at Bellevue Baptist Church under the leadership of Senior Pastor, Dr. Steve Gaines.
Integrity Does Count, Inc. will hold a church-wide meeting away from the campus of BBC on or before February 16, 2007, where it hopes to address the above concerns as well as to establish a congregation-approved framework for church governance that will include up-to-date bylaws and regulations. An attempt was made to seek approval for an on-campus meeting. A further attempt was made to obtain a mailing list of church membership in order to inform each member of the upcoming, church-wide meeting. Both attempts were futile, and IDC’s requests were denied by BBC staff members.
The church administration has willfully neglected to uphold the State of Tennessee Statute, T.C.A. 48-66-101 et. seq., that governs Not-For-Profit organizations and leaves this incorporated group of BBC wondering what the church administration stands to gain by locking its doors and closing its books.
Realizing the necessity for following God’s design as illustrated in Matthew 18, and missing the fellowship of faithful members who are choosing to worship in sister churches, Integrity Does Count, Inc. is even more compelled to sound its voice, take necessary measures, and use all available resources for seeking the truth concerning questionable events and actions within Bellevue Baptist Church in Cordova, Tennessee.
A few questions, I have…
1. When does this kind of thing (if ever) become necessary?
2. When is it time to just let go and leave?
3. How, particularly in a Baptist, congregational rule church, does a group all of a sudden become convinced that nearly every leader in their church (most of whom they’ve elected) are all evil and lack integrity?
4. If you’re a member of the leadership in this church, what do you do with members who go on the record and start a splinter group from within the church to fight your leadership?
5. Is anything EVER gained for the cause of Christ through this kind of exchange?
Please understand… I am by no means saying that all that has happened (particularly with the recent staff firing) was done correctly or incorrectly; and I’m not taking sides on which side is actually correct… my question is more: how far should a congregant (or a group of congregants) go to get the outcome they feel is correct? And how much of this is fueled by a ‘this is MY church’, ‘this is OUR church’ type thing?
Please… help me understand better be telling me what you think? Take a few minutes to answer the above questions. I think it’s valuable to do so, if only because this very well could happen in your church in the near future. It seems to be a growing trend…
Thanks,
Yes, that's correct... there is now a group of members of Bellevue Baptist that has formed it's own group officially opposing the church leadership. On their new website (integritydoescount.com) they say... "It is not uncommon for leadership changes within a church to result in some discontent and even discord within its membership. But, for a group of members inside a church of 30,000 to incorporate themselves, form a board of directors, and set out for the sole purpose of instilling accountability in its own church government and leadership is unusual and perhaps unprecedented."
Comments
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Oliver on Mon, January 29, 2007
here are the numbers, 25% of pastors (out of 300) admitted to have a sexual affair with someone other than their wife while being in ministry, its believed that as many as 65% of pastors will a sexual affair while in ministry. In the general population its the same as 60-65% of men and 50-55% of women. “Torn Asunder: Recovering from Extramarital Affairs (Moody)”. So let me restate, and retract my last comment and say, statistically, over half the men in ministry today are probably having an extra marital affair, and the church isn’t doing anything about it.
Todd Rhoades on Mon, January 29, 2007
OFF TOPIC…
This isn’t about pastor in immorality… this is about the group that is forming inside Bellevue…
Back to the discussion please.
Todd
Chris Gilliam on Mon, January 29, 2007
Oliver- Context?
What is sad is that from my estimation (someone correct me if I am wrong) the staff member in question would have been 17 at the time of the offence and I have yet to see if the person he “molested” ( I use the term loosely) was a 15 year old consensual thing or legitimately child rape. (The Legal term is nebulous) Don’t wrongly assume that I am week on sin but when someone flies an accusation the interpretation of the event is important. Two examples 1. It IS different if this was a 17 year old who had sex with a 15-16 year old who then later in life repented and was born again and now wants to rid self of self condemnation. 2. A Malicious 17 who is raping 6 year olds. The accusation out there implies for most people who are inundated with the recent media events around priest that the second interpretation is correct. This is malice! The fact that this person has not been arrested and that Dr. Gaines is demonstrating prudence in how to handle this (See 1 Tim 5.22 in context) leads me to believe the first may be true. If that is the case then neither you nor I are close enough to weigh on this and If we think we are then we are in danger. I ask in reference to Jesus comments “He who looks… HAS… Who then can really to the nth degree to claim above reproach? Biblical Worldview is much need in our “Christians” today. So is understanding of Authority and who places it there.
Lori on Mon, January 29, 2007
Chris,
Since you asked for the facts here they are in a nut shell. They are pulled together from MMI postings as well as Bellvue.org the church’s website where the investigation report is available.
17 years ago, the minister in question, who served as an associate pastor at the church with 55 staff members, molested his then teenage son for 12 -18 months.
He then repented, later told his wife, and later a RETIRED associate pastor.
In 2005 his family including his NOW married son and daughter-in-law went into counseling where the issue was addressed. The counselor and later another former pastor of the Biblical Counseling Office(who was told in early 2006) of the church encouraged him to confess to the Pastor.
This man did confess to the Senior Pastor in June 2006 who decidedly was confused about steps to take since it appeared to all involved that nothing of the sort had taken place in the last 17 years and that his job did not have contact with children.
The senior pastor was confronted by the son in December 2006 as to why no action had been taken since the confession.
At this point the Senior Pastor place the man on leave and the investigation process by a committee and not the pastor, began and has been completed with report and this man’s termination.
The report includes stern reproaches for all you knew and failed to report or act.
The group in question on this post has formed a formal incorporation against not just the Senior Pastor but the entire church leadership - most who had no knowledge or involvement in the crisis. The question on this board is whether this appropriate, Christ-like and good for the kingdom. And when, if ever, it is approrpiate for a group inside a church to take such action.
To reiterrate, their complaints are against the HANDLING of the situation, NOT that the person who molested his son is still with the church.
While I agree that it was probably handled poorly, from reading their material, it appears that there is a bigger play for power against a pastor who has followed in the footsteps of a long time, well known, now deceased Pastor. This church’s government proceedures are by elected by the church committee members and not a dictatorial staff set-up as some have suggested.
Chris Gilliam on Mon, January 29, 2007
Thanks Lori- I hope though my comments did make sence in light of my ignorance. I just think alot of people jump when we should instead kneel.
Lane on Mon, January 29, 2007
In responding to Cody, and also just trying to keep a general perspective on this without getting bogged down into details, let me elaborate my earlier comment. The question was asked by Todd (#5) as to whether anything good can come from a situation where a leader is publicly questioned by the congregants. While most people respond “no,” and talk at length about how we have to preserve unity, my response is (again) simply this… You cannot say that nothing good can result from these types of situations while simultaneously enjoying a Protestant fellowship. That’s like saying that you believe the lottery is wrong while living in a mansion that was paid for through lottery winnings. In studying church history, you have to make a decision… either Luther’s rebellion to the church was rebellion to God… or it was a Spirit-led movement to expose church hypocrisy. If you worship in a protestant church… you vote with your feet (despite what you post here) that the latter was true.
Secondly, the statement that the church is not a democracy is not ENTIRELY true. While most leaders and pastors will say this to secure their authority… most of them ignore the fact that they were voted in when they first came to the church. So why was public opinion (albeit spirit-led, hopefully) the device used to confirm their entrance to the church but then no longer deemed valid in later affairs.
Third, to bring Scripture to this. Research the historical context to why Paul even wrote 1 Corinthians. A delegation from the church visited Paul (1 Cor. 16:17) with a letter to let him know what was going on. It’s interesting that while Paul speaks against division in the church, (1 Cor. 1:10) he never seems to denounce the process by which the information came to him. (1 Cor. 1:11).
I_am_not on Mon, January 29, 2007
1. When does this kind of thing (if ever) become necessary?
Guess necessity is a relative term, but from what I’ve read, this group of believers hasn’t been able to voice their concerns within a congregational meeting of the church.
2. When is it time to just let go and leave?
Is this question for the people of this group, or the pastor? I don’t think any believer should just let go and leave their home church unless God tells them to do so. Wonder how many of this group have actually asked God whether this situation is His way of telling “them” they need to move on?
3. How, particularly in a Baptist, congregational rule church, does a group all of a sudden become convinced that nearly every leader in their church (most of whom they’ve elected) are all evil and lack integrity?
I don’t believe this is a good presumption.
4. If you’re a member of the leadership in this church, what do you do with members who go on the record and start a splinter group from within the church to fight your leadership?
Meet with them privately to try and resolve the issue(s) and if that doesn’t work, go to an open congregational meeting.
5. Is anything EVER gained for the cause of Christ through this kind of exchange?
Ultimately, yes…if trust and integrity of leadership are restored.
Scott Miller on Mon, January 29, 2007
Think this pretty much sums it up… a pretty sad video of the times we live in…
“ME Church”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAg1rRbxrGY
Scott
Jake Marthler on Mon, January 29, 2007
I have no idea what to say because this article tells us nothing about what’s going on, other than there are some concerned members. Is that why you provided the links? Is that where the issues are? Going from this article alone, you’d have no clue what the issue(s) is/are.
Shelly on Mon, January 29, 2007
Everytime I read the articles on this site, I become discouraged about the state of our churches. Does anyone remember that our job is to reach a lost world and make disciples of them?
I have a suggestion for struggling congregations….everyone from the leader on down to the newest members should fast and pray and don’t stop until everyone involved is humbled before God.
Do not talk to the media. Do not post info on the web. Do not call for a vote. Do not fight in public.
Just fast and pray and humble ourselves before God.
Jan on Mon, January 29, 2007
Gib said: “There is no way this accomplishes anything for the cause of Christ because how can he be glorified through division? If Christ can’t be glorified, how can it be “right”. “
I totally agree! Christ prayed for the unity of the church, so it must be important. And I believe that division grieves the heart of God.
And there is such a thing has having a little class. It’s time for these people to move on and let the Holy Spirit do His work here.
Very very sad.
Oliver on Mon, January 29, 2007
of course this is about immorality, that is part of the story at BCC! Its about how institutional organizations often protect their leadership at the sake of integrity and the victims! its about where the power lies in the institutional church! anybody can see that! I agree with shelley, this site is depressing! but lets look beyond the sad articles, this site reflects like a mirror the sickness that has engulfed our churches. Why? simple, because its become politicized, its about power and money. It no longer is about making disciples! I am just shocked that people like todd can’t see what is so obvious. One solution is too leave those sick institutions, and live out biblical christianity apart from the sickness.
Wendi on Mon, January 29, 2007
Shelley asks: [Does anyone remember that our job is to reach a lost world and make disciples of them?]
Great question of course. This terrible situation is a reminder to us of our propensity toward idolatry. Anything that consumes our emotions; that we must make right; that motivates, masters or controls us; that becomes the topic of nearly every conversation; that we must preserve at all costs; that we are preoccupied with . . . these are idols. I feel this group at Bellevue has an idolatry problem.
And every moment of mental and emotional energy that we give to something is a moment we cannot give to something else. Let’s be reminded that we must steward our energies toward the things Shelley reminds us about . . . reaching the lost and making disciples.
And Oliver, I don’t think Shelley was suggesting that this site is depressing, but rather that this situation is depressing. On the contrary, MMI is filled with great examples of churches that are beautiful examples of Christ’s bride. On occasion Todd posts articles like this, which can be depressing and cause us to run for the hills as you suggest, or can challenge and remind us to live and minister differently. I’ll choose the later.
Wendi
Tony Story on Mon, January 29, 2007
This is so CARNAL!! I knew it was a denominational church by just reading the headlines. The way to stop this “reproachful” mess, that does nothing but cause the unsaved to look at the church with great disdain, is this: Get out of the Denominational bondage and politics. Let the men of God start their own works and have people in leadership who love God more than their positions and tell the abomination, oops, I mean denomination, and the pharisees to take a hike.
Randy Ehle on Mon, January 29, 2007
I was too close to this type of situation a few years ago, and it continues to mar my vision for churches. I grieve for all involved - on both sides - for all are being hurt, regardless of whether they realize it.
A couple brief comments: first, a church generally will have no obligations to an external organization such as has been formed in this case, so in that respect it seems a waste of time, money, and effort on the part of the organizers. Second, a Baptist church of Bellevue’s size likely includes in its Constitution and/or By-Laws several provisions for calling a congregational meeting - including by members of the congregation. More than likely, it’s a very small number (e.g., 5-10% of the membership, perhaps). If that provision is met, then the officers of the church must call a meeting. As far as setting the agenda for that meeting, it would likely be determined in the petition for the meeting.
I am not suggesting this is the best way to get things done around a congregational church, but such processes are (or ought to be) spelled out. I have a feeling that if the dissenting minority at my church had called for such a meeting (though they probably didn’t have the votes to call one in the first place), then the usually-silent majority would have shown up and shut down that minority. Unfortunately, in our case, the vocal minority was too smart to do that, and instead waged a war of division at the leadership level.
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