Thank you I seach the church To Join if here in Tanzania or in U.S.A OR UK

THANK YOU

Randy E. said:
“I actually appreciated the notes that I received. I disagree with Fred and Bernie’s take on this as “tieing the hands of the Holy Spirit.” Any search committee worth its salt has bathed the process in prayer...and if they haven’t done that, then I’m not sure I want to work at that church anyway.”

Randy, when I said “yup.” I wasn’t referring to the previous email (Freds); sorry for the confusion.  Just the opposite; I was trying to say a follow-up is vital, and should be encouraging, whether the applicant is chosen or not.

...Bernie

I would have to agree with the comments that I seen posted here. Over the years I have applied with churches of various sizes and have not received a letter or email saying that my appliction or resume was received or that I did not get the job.

In the past when this has happened to me. It has upset me for two reason. One, it made me feel as though I was worthless, even though I know that I am not, and did not deserve any respect. Two, it would make me mad because because these are people of God treating God’s people with no love or respect. If God has called us to love those around us then we must show love in all things, no matter how small they may be. If the world we live in shows us more love and respect than our fellow Christians then how does this reflect upon the fruits that we produce? We as christians show be showing more love and respcest to our fellow man than the world that we live in.

It seems common for churches to not contact their applicants to let them know whether their resume has been considered or even considered.  I had sent out over 100 resume’s and have had a couple of interviews.  Other than those, not a word from any of the churches/organizations. If you do receive a response it’s a form letter that is cold and heartless stating how you do not meet their requirements.  How do they know if they don’t even talk with you.  I am amazed at the coldness of our churches and the search committees.  We’ve often said to ourselves, “If this was the resume’ of one of the committee members, they’d except a response and they’d be on top of it.” One pastor friend we know found out in a church business meeting the church was not considering him.  They were at the church at the request of the committee and then the chairman stood up and said, “Pray as we continue our search.  We have not found the right person yet.” That was said without even saying one word to the pastor candidate in the congregation. 
I am presently out of the ministry.  The children’s ministries we have led were extremely successful and prospered beyond words.  Since 1996 we have counseled many that have been burnt by congregations, other pastors, ministries, etc.  There are many out there and very few with listening ears and compassion.  We are losing it as a family in the House of God. Our own children who are in their 20’s want very little to do with the church because of how the church treats its’ ministers and their families.  One of our daughters said the word she’d use to discribe the church is “RUDE!”.  I agree with Jamie Glasgow’s response - “It is really a shame!” and I have never met her, but relate with her.

Dear Todd,
Interesting comments on receiving a rejection letter if you are not accepted for a position at a church. I applied for a position as a Pastor through church staffing. I did receive a rejection letter which stated and I quote” Don’t quite your day job don’t call us and we won’t call you” and the letter went on to say a few more things. Is this Christian Love? I have been a Christian for almost 40 years and I can tell you, yes there is a great deal wrong with the churches today and this is only one of their problems. Many churches, for their beliefs and practices should remove the name Christian from their lexacon. To me they only bring shame and disgrace to my wonderful Lord Jesus. Is it any wonder why the Press and media have only contempt for Christianity today. Is it any wonder why so many people are leaving the church? Is it any wonder why Christians are scorned and mocked for their beliefs or more accuratly their total lack of Biblical values and principles.

Enough said.
God Bless one and all,
Dr. Peter Nahodyl PhD. Minister of the Gospel

Without trying to look like just another link in the chain of frustration here, I think this process is a combination of things. Just as most of you I experienced the occasional rejection email and amicable phone interview with both parties agreeing that going our separate ways was best. However, I also experienced many non communicative situations as well. In some instances when I called to check up on my resume some did tell me that the response was overwhelming. But I agree with the countless others that more must be done about this process. Since this door has been opened the church world is struggling immensely. With the new dawn of websites offering services to both job seekers and churches the market has opened opportunities for people from all walks of life. And with that comes the frustration and aggrivation one gets when dealing with churches and how things get done. So many factors are involved when you talk about an organization(church) that consists of volunteers and paid staff. Things will work much slower because there’s sacred cows to contend with, personalities, and preferences that come into play. Unfortunately I’ve seen this very problem occur with other non profit organizations. Same kind of challenge. It almost seems that groups with great causes seem to struggle the most with good communication, and excellence in executing proper procedures. One thing though, could help if websites offering this mediator service require that churches contact their applicants when they have received resumes and give notification whether the applicant has the job or not. Perhaps an email survey could be filled out by both parties which would give insite as to the process of hiring church positions. That way if you had a particular church with this problem the survey would send off a red flag that shows they haven’t contacted their applicants. then the “powers that be” could notify the church of the responses people are giving about their effiency in this area. It could be an emailed report or even phone calls could be make if it persists. Although Of course, something this large would require a lot of man hours and work. Just a thought. Maybe someone has a modified suggestion to this solution.

I second the remarks about the self-centeredness of most churches.  Many require candidates to “jump through hoops” that require a great deal of time and energy or which reflect worldly standards (sending samples of work, videos, completing very lengthy questionnaires full of questions which should have been saved for the interview process, sending a picture before the church will even talk to you--never did get that one!!--etc.).  And many qualified applicants are expected to juggle all this with the demands of a CURRENT full time job and family!  The expectations of these prospective employers are often unrealistically high (sometimes I’m not sure that Jesus Himself would make the cut), yet their salaries are often shamefully low.  And yes, I’ve had experience with the pre-interview meetings where churches take advantage of applicants within driving distance to make an often- hasty assessment of “fit.”

I’ve encountered a broad spectrum of consideration when it comes to notification of where I am in the process.  When churches are thoughtful and keep me informed, I make a point of thanking them profusely and let them know that their caring reveals a lot about their character.  As for the others...Unless they have a very good explanation for keeping me entirely in the dark, I knock non-communicative churches off of my list, even if they come back to me weeks or months later.

I agree with all these comments that I have read.  I am working on my MDIV and I was called to full time ministry 3 years ago asa youth minister but yet I am not yet in a full time position.  Every church that God has ever called me to has rejected me.  It is horrible when our churches can’t even figure out God’s will for their church.  They can’t even act like christians when they turn you done.  I’m sure I’m not the only one that can’t make a living due to churches hiring the wrong people.
I recently received a rejection letter from a church that God clearly called me and my wife too.  Our response was that each of us wrote a letter back to that pastor describing our call to make sure that he knew that he had made the wrong decision.  I’m hoping I hear back from him in the next couple of days.
We must have a different system of hiring staff members or else these problems that everybody seems to be having will not end.
Those of us who know and acknowledge the problems are the ones that must change them if we are ever in a position where we can do something about it.

I have 15 years of experience in corporate Human Resources on 3 continents.  I’ve also been in ministry for many years and I’m the part-time associate pastor for a small church seeking a full-time pastor.

The biggest problem with most churches doing staff searches is that few have anyone helping them do it that has any HR expertise.  As a result, their HR “process” can be extremely lacking.  In addition, depending on the position, there are legal and regulatory considerations.  The Holy Spirit works best with those who are trained, whether it be in HR or the Bible.

Even in this day and age, it’s overwhelming to try to respond to every resume which comes into the office, whether that is a corporate office or church office.  Unsolicited resumes should not expect a response.  If you get one, consider yourself fortunate.  Think of it this way: how many pieces of unsoliticted mail do you get at home trying to sell you something?  Do you write back and tell them “no thank you”?  I know this sounds harsh, but few churches have the manpower necessary to respond to every resume received.  We received 60 before we even put out the word we were looking for a pastor. 

As for those who have actually been contacted by a church for a discussion or interview, YES, it is totally inexcuseable not to contact that person and tell them they have been given due consideration and are no longer being considered for the position.  That is indeed common courtesy in any hiring situation.

Let me say a word about resumes.  If you plan to submit one, PLEASE have someone with corporate hiring experience review it.  I can’t tell you how many resumes I’ve seen from potential staff members that were horrible.  Your resume IS your first impression.  There is no excuse for misspelled words, poor grammar and other instances of bad writing.  Take your resume seriously—you can be sure the committee who reviews it will. 

Finally, if you have not been through any kind of interview situation in awhile, I suggest you set up a mock interview with someone—even if it’s your spouse, who can ask you questions that might be asked by a search committee.  It helps you formulate your thinking and answers ahead of time. And remember - be completed, but be brief.  Our committee asked one potential pastor, “Tell us about yourself,” and he stopped talking after 50 minutes! 

God bless the seekers and the sought.

I appreciate this discussion and the many comments that have been made, even those with which I disagree.

Having been in a search for staff positions a number of times, and over long periods of time, I agree that a church owes a response to an applicant as a “professional courtesy”, if nothing else.

One of the reasons that many churches do not do this is because they lack professional skills and wisdom.  Most of those who are part of a search committee are not trained professionals.  Most pastors, if conducting a search, are not trained in that way either.

I was totally oblivious to this idea until our most recent search.  I have tried to respond to every candidate’s application, though I might have allowed some to fall through the cracks.

Other posters have mentioned that sometimes a church is deluged with applicants...that’s a good and important insight.  For us, we have had hundreds of responses to our opening.  Nobody is going to write a detailed, personal letter to each person who applied.

For those of you hurt by a “form letter” with no reasons as to why your application was turned down, and/or stating that you weren’t qualified...the church has no obligation or need to include that information.  While it’s true that they don’t really know you, the opposite is true in that you really don’t know them either.

A rude or insulting letter from a church is one thing, but a simple acknowledgment and informing that an applicant is not going to be considered is as much (and even more) than what most businesses do.

And for anyone who walks into a church ministry with a chip on their shoulder because of not being treated with professional respect in the hiring process, just wait until you see how you’re treated once you land a position...even if the hiring process was very professional (with some exceptions).

This whole thing goes both ways...once again, I believe a church should be professional in their approach.  But I think it’s important that the applicant should respond in a professional way...even when not treated in a professional way.

I could give examples of “resumes”, intro-ductory letters, and materials sent that would make you wonder why the person would even think they would be hired for any position.  In some ways, they are just as insulting as some of the letters that some on this blog have received.  Yet...we responded to them in (what I hope was) a professional way.

In addition, we have personally contacted individuals whose resume appeared on Churchstaffing.com and other websites of this nature.  We informed them about the opportunity, etc. and asked for them to respond back indicating their interest.

Just like the churches not contacting applicants, the vast majority of the applicants never even acknowledged our inquiries.  Frustrating?  Yes...and we could have stewed over it...but we just needed to move on.

We have had candidates come, we spend lots of money bringing them in...have a great time with them...and everything seems to be on track...then, they decided to say “no” based on issues that they already indicated
they were OK with…

We’ve even had candidates indicate interest ...we buy them plane tickets… and they called to cancel the trip...sticking us with the bill.

Sometimes churches aren’t very professional and sometimes candidates aren’t very professional…

But, somewhere in all of this we have to take this beyond what is professional and understand God’s leading in all of it… whether everything is handled professionally or not. 

When I came to pastor my present church, I got the information for my salary package handwritten on a scratch piece of paper and received a very short letter from a part time Secretary that esseentially said, “Yeah...come if you want”.  It wasn’t very professional...but it was God’s leading.  And God has blessed the ministry beyond anything I could have ever imagined. 

MW:
I’m in your corner brother.
I have sent hundreds of resumes when looking for a church to pastor.
I almost never hear back from churches who add my resume to the trash can.
And the churches that consider looking at my resume might say they are considering it but almost never anything else.
Once in a great while I geta “thank you” or a “we have decided to go another direction”
I have gotten “since you have a masters degee we can’t afford you”
Two times I’ve gotten my resume back with “not suitable” and once with red writing all over the resume but no explaination as to why they returned it.
Churches seem to think that ministers whether they be pastors or not are hired not called and just like secular employers they conduct the search in that manner.
But I’ll keep tryin because no matter what else I still feel God’s call to be a shepherd.
God bless
Richard

I definitely agree with “Me again.” I haven’t searched for church jobs often, but the last time I did, it was very disheartening. And, the secular companies I applied to were more courteous. I was applying for an assistant to the Music Director type of job. I only received 2 emails from the Music Director acknowledging that he’d received my application, but then it was up to me to keep calling to find out what the next step was. It took over 3 months to finally get ahold of the secretary who told me that they were pursuing another applicant exclusively. I have written a letter to send to this church to let them know that I did not feel like they treated me like Christ would have them do, but I chickened out and never sent it.
Happy ending: I did get another job at a different church and I am very happy there. ANd, I’ve gotten over my disappointment with church A since my husband and I attend there together.

I would like to second what MB said about the quality of letters and resumes that churches receive. I have seen some myself that made me laugh.

As far as churches not following up, this has been one of my biggest gripes about the whole stinking process (and trust me, it stinks). It’s bad enough when you don’t get a reponse and you are in a church with a regular salary, but when you are unemployed, and are having to make lomg term decisions based on whether or not a certain church works out, it’s maddening.