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What do you Love? What do you Hate?

Orginally published on Monday, May 09, 2005 at 8:57 AM
by Todd Rhoades

David D. Ireland has a new book coming next week entitled Perfecting Your Purpose. In it, he discusses one way to begin to discover the exact purpose God has for you in your ministry. David writes…

"Google is one of the most powerful search engines on the web. If you surf to the website http://www.google.com and type in a word, this search engine looks through almost five billion web pages of information in moments to locate all of the sites that reference your subject.

Similarly, if you went to God's search engine to gather a greater understanding about His purpose for your life, I would encouarge you to perform two different searches back to back. First, you would type in the word love, and second, you would key in the word hate. These two powerful human emotions embody the keys to unlocking your purpose. Ezekiel discovered this principle because his hate for the moral bankruptcy of his people along with his undying love for the Lord moved him to lie on his left and right sides as a prophetic sign.

Ask yourself two vital questions: What do I love most? And what do I hate most? I am referring to your love or hate of items, processes, vocations, and the like, not people. Jesus made it quite clear that if we intend to follow His leadership and submit to His behavioral requirements, we have only one option of behavior toward people -- to love them.

1. What Do You Love the Most?
Have you given any thought to what you love to do? I love explaining things to people, and this love has manifested itself as a teaching gift. I enjoy debating about controversial or philosophical subjects that demand logical thinking and sharp communication skills. Hence, part of my life's purpose is to empower people who need a ready defense against intellectual bullies and false teachers bent on misleading people.

What do you love the most? Don't overlook the significance of your answer because it may contain the direction that you have been waiting for. Use this question as a self-discovery tool to guide you to your purpose.

2. What Do You Have the Most?
It often seems much easier to see the value of love than the value of hate. I suspect the reason is that people seek love and run from hate. In fact, in its most general form the word love occurs 310 times in the King James Version of the Bible. The word hate, on the other hand appears 87 times. Despite its fewer times mentioned in the Scriptures, hate offers a service that you should not underestimate or ignore. Human beings, particularly Christians, just hate to think that there could be any value in hating something. Nevertheless, hate has its benefits.

Ask yourself: What do I hate most? Then zero in on hate from two perspectives. First, think of the things that trouble you -- the things that you avoid. For example, I just hate wasting time, so I keep my distance from and minimize my involvement with people who like to waste time. This aspect of hate is not an indicator of purpose. Second, think of the things that you hate so much that you're always thinking of ways to fix or solve the problems that they present.

I hate chaos and confusion in people's lifes. Seeing projects or organizational systems of any size in disarray irritates me. But over the years I noticed that I was constantly being drawn into situations involving these areas. After a time of introspection and after receiving positive feedback following many of my restructuring tasks, I discovered that I have a gift of administration and organization. The very antithesis of the things I hate -- chaos and disorder -- is the area where one of my strongest gifts lies."

Do an analysis this morning... what is it that you really love to do and the things you really hate doing? It could help you define exactly where and how God wants you to serve in the future!"

FOR DISCUSSION: What do you love the most? What do you hate the most? Which of these things recharge your emotions? Which ones drain you? Does determining the things you hate help you at all in discovering your life's purpose?

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TRACKBACKS: (0) There are 51 Comments:

Posted by

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 9:42 AM

Excelent article. I’m going to try this. It makes perfect sense. Amazing something so simple is often overlooked. I’ll bet that’s why so many people are not happy in what they are doing. He/she isn’t using all of what they love to do, which according to the article is something God has placed in us. The next challenging question would be When does someone know when the things they hate are a problem with their attitude as opposed to a strong desire to change that circumstance? For example, Pastor xxxx strongly desire is bothered by poor organization and feels terrible when things go wrong because of it. However, Pastor xxxx is laid back and passive regarding his approach to the matter (ie. disregards others leaders suggestions, fails to plan ahead ect.). What is this man’s or woman’s approach? Does he/she love organization and hate getting there? Or is there another love/hate feeling going on in this matter? Secondly, what about those individuals whose attitute changes towards the things they hate? Does that mean their purpose has changed as well? Or is this an attitude issue as well? I think in some situations there are more going on in the picture of someone’s life that just what you love and hate(avoid). After writing down what we love and what we hate maybe we should write down the reasons for the things we hate. Maybe that would give us a perspective as to why we hate them. Maybe the reasons are selfish and not based on purpose at all. Just a thought.
Posted by

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 12:44 PM

For me what is important is what Jesus loves and hates. Jesus loved the Father He was obedient unto Him even unto the death of the cross. Jesus equated love and obedience and said “If you love Me obey My Commandments.” On the other hand Jesus hated hypocrisy and the Nicolaitanes. Next, look to see how Jesus handled these things. Regarding the cross it was not presumption but according to God’s time. Regarding hypocrisy and nicolaitanes Jesus rebuked them showing us how to be light and salt. The devil is always trying to make us obedient unto him or his minions. Christ tells us to go directly to the Father calling Him our Teacher and Rabbi and following His example in the Son.
Posted by

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 2:45 PM

Also notice that Jesus when confronted was always confronted by the religious leaders and usually trying to trap Him.

He didn’t speak unkindly to those who needed Him, the woman at the well, the blind, sick, lame, the cast the first stone story.

The only time He spoke with an “anger” was towards the religious leaders. Why?

Sin. Improper knowledge and understanding.

These ideas creeping into the church (Perfecting Your Purpose) bring with them the subtilty of humanism, in that, we use these “study approaches” (as in the example from the book) to improve ourselves and our vision and then say “it is from God”.

Keep a critical eye on these humanistic tendencies Christian, they are not from God but rather a divise of the Enemy of God.

Instead of using google to search love and hate, consider searching the “doctrines” of humanism and how they very closely relate to the 9 belief statements of satanism.

Scripture does not teach us to think better of ourselves but rather to consider how utterly sinful we are. The Apostle Paul’s understanding of this very basic yet seemingly illusive concept is understood by his view of himself at the beginning of his ministry:
BEGINNING OF PAUL’S MINISTRY
Considering himself the least of the apostles (on a scale of “righteousness”, the apostles were no doubt near the top - yet Paul places himself at the bottom of that list of names)

MIDDLE OF PAUL’S MINISTRY
Paul later reveals to himself that he considers himself the least of all the saints (a VERY big drop in the scale of righteousness but, at least he is still on the scale)

END OF PAUL’S MINISTRY
when Paul makes the statement that he is the Chiefest of sinners, it should bake our noodle of understanding that we are not righteous, not one of us.... don’t use the humanistic tendencies to confirm your belief that God wants you to think highly of yourself, God wants you to think highly of Jesus and His Work, not of you and your purpose. Your purpose is in Him, preach the Gospel in truth and sacrifice (the Ultimate Portrate of Love) and make disciples of men (teaching them about Him).

Beware Christian, the idealogy of today is beginning to call evil good and good evil. Which makes me to recall the Scriptures statement “will the Son of man indeed find faith on the earth when He returns?”

This is to say, people will say they have faith but do they really? Or has the idea created a dead faith (as oppossed to a saving faith) and deceived them.

Take heed that you not be deceived. We are masters at deceiving even ourselves… test the beliefs and teachings of today in truth, not through the eyes of what you “want” to believe but what Scripture really says.

Enough for my soap box.

Don’t buy the book and don’t believe the idea behind the book. It’s calling you to humanism, in the name of God (God forbid!).
Posted by

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 3:10 PM

Quote: “These ideas creeping into the church (Perfecting Your Purpose) bring with them the subtilty of humanism, in that, we use these “study approaches” (as in the example from the book) to improve ourselves and our vision and then say “it is from God”.

Keep a critical eye on these humanistic tendencies Christian, they are not from God but rather a divise of the Enemy of God.”

They’re not only creeping they’re sprinting throughout the Church because of the “feel good about myself” mentality that we see in articles like the one above.

What’s even more disappointing is that such articles are given prominent places on Christian sites, which only serves to spread the heresy further and the infection deeper.

God, have mercy on us.
Posted by Todd Rhoades

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 3:28 PM

As Ronald Reagan would say, “Here we go again"…

First off, it is my utter sinfulness that drives me to make a difference for the Kingdom. Because Christ forgave me, I have new life that needs to be shared with others.

Thanks, Ricky, at least this time you said the “H” word. Heresy?! Really?

Come on, guys, this is NOT humanism… what is wrong with saying “this is where my strengths lie (another way of saying, this is how God has gifted/wired me), so I’m going to play my strengths for the Kingdom’s benefit”? To me, this is just so blatently obvious that it’s almost not worth discussing.

The article pointed out the adverse of that… what do I hate? Just cause the sentence had the word ‘me’ or ‘I’ in it doesn’t make it humanistic.

For some reason, there is a sentiment out there that for some reason says (or at least implies to me) that if I am enjoying myself in ministry that I’m either in that position because I seek glory for myself; or that I’m really not doing God’s work, because if I was, the “world will hate me”. (And I know that we’ll all face persecution and trials).

But the same Bible that says the trials and persecution parts also said the Jesus came so that I could live my life “more abundantly”. In my opinion, it is part of my duty to find out my purpose; to find where God wants to use me… to find out how God can best use me (yes, me!) for his Kingdom work.

Bottom line… I want my life to make a difference in the Kingdom… and yes, I’d like to feel good while doing it. Ministry is a blast when you’re plugged into the right spot… or as this author would say “doing what you love and not what you hate”.

So while some think a person like me might have a “feel good about myself” mentality, I wonder how many pastors cling to the Word and hate what they’re doing (and being highly ineffective while doing it).

I’m sure glad God reads our motives better than men (especially better than some of the readers of this blog!)

Have a great one!

Todd
Posted by

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 4:29 PM

Todd asked:
“I wonder how many pastors cling to the Word and hate what they’re doing (and being highly ineffective while doing it).”

Me.
Posted by Todd Rhoades

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 4:44 PM

Hey Art… hang in there. You’re not alone. I think (know) that there are a tremendous amount of pastors in your situation. I’ll pray that God will show you what direction he’d have you to go so that you can be more effective for the Kingdom and actually enjoy the calling God has given you!

Todd
Posted by

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 5:10 PM

I support! Todd your right on the money. I am not one to bash those whose opinions I disagree with, but what is wrong with understanding how best to be affective for the Kingdom of God. I say to Harry, Ricky, and Mr. Annoymous you’d better check “yo self”. I mean no disrespect, but the less you understand how you work and why you lean towards certain areas of interest more than others the less likely you’ll understand how to more affectively serve those you are trying to help. That’s the very problem you see today. There are too many people messin’ in areas of ministry that aren’t part of their strengths. I’ve seen that pattern all my life and the end result is death. Death for the leader and the follower. For lack of better terms, “lighten up”. This approach is in no way humanistic. It’s mearly systematic and that’s not a bad thing. Remember, others are reading your posts even sinners, “Ricky”. I say this in love because I used to be very judgemental and even now need God everyday to surpress this harmful disease. Only by God’s grace I am who I am and the more I can know how and why God has made me this way only leads towards a path God has made distincly for me. No one can do what I can do and no one can do what you can do. That is God’s way. He uses whom He chooses and He wants to use me and you.
Posted by bernie dehler

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 8:06 PM

There is a balance between doing what you were “built for” and doing what God’s will is. The article is great about finding your strenghts and interests, and zero at determining God’s will. People may be called to things they don’t want to do, such as dying for Christ as a testimony. Example, probably nobody WANTS to go into the bush to reach natives, or suffer malaria, etc. for Christ. People don’t do this because they sought out what they love-- rather, it’s in obediance to follow God’s leading. They fear man more than God.

Nobody wants to be persecuted or killed for Christ, but that may be a calling. We can either accept it or shrink back. Too many people shrink back because they want to be PC.

Basically, I’m saying the article was one-sided and not balanced… It’s like hearing just one side of an argument… very misleading…

Hebrews 10:
37For in just a very little while,
“He who is coming will come and will not delay.
38But my righteous one will live by faith.
And if he shrinks back,
I will not be pleased with him.” 39But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who believe and are saved.

...Bernie
http://freegoodnews.blogspot.com
Posted by Todd Rhoades

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 8:12 PM

Bernie,

Absolutely.. everyone, please understand this was three paragraphs of a 282 page book… it wasn’t meant to be a ‘be-all end-all’ to finding your purpose.

Of course no one likes to be burned at the stake; and ministry isn’t always a walk in the park.

There’s always the paradox (and pleasure) of knowing that you’re doing God’s will even though it’s not what you would have done personally; and not your preference. Nothing can describe that peace.

But nothing, as well, can describe the joy and excitement of ministering and serving in an area that you are talented and gifted in. And sometimes God will even allow that to happen!

Todd
Posted by

Monday, May 09, 2005 at 10:18 PM

“People don’t do this because they sought out what they love-- rather, it’s in obediance to follow God’s leading. They fear man more than God.”

If a person doesn’t love what they are doing for God, whether it means personal suffering or not, then they really are not doing it out of the right motivation or attitude. The only reason I am still a pastor is because I am afraid God will not bless me, will hate me, and hurt me somehow if I leave the ministry. I fear Him taking it out on my wife, my son, if I am not “obedient to the call.”

Is that really what God wants from His servants. “Yeah God, I will serve you...because I am a afraid you will kill me!” Is that what God really wants from us?
Posted by bernie

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 12:27 AM

Anony says:
“If a person doesn’t love what they are doing for God, whether it means personal suffering or not, then they really are not doing it out of the right motivation or attitude.”

As Christians, our goal and journey is to be more Christ-like (we will never get there, perfectly, this side of heaven). This entails moving from being self-centered to being God-centered. God does make us with special gifts and it’s good to use them. But also, we need to seek His will, and not just “what feels good.”

...Bernie
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/247/
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 1:31 AM

TODD WRITES:
Bottom line… I want my life to make a difference in the Kingdom… and yes, I’d like to feel good while doing it. Ministry is a blast when you’re plugged into the right spot… or as this author would say “doing what you love and not what you hate”.

BeHim responds:
Todd, will you make a difference in the Kingdom of Heaven? Why?

This is a totally humanistic statement:
Bottom line… I WANT MY life to make a difference in the Kingdom… and yes, I’D LIKE to FEEL good while doing it. Ministry is a blast when YOU’RE plugged into the RIGHT SPOT… or as this author would say “doing what YOU love and NOT WHAT YOU hate”.

I’m not playing semantics, I’m revealing the idea/concept (a “motive” being taught and displayed) that serves the servant not the King!

TODD WRITES:
So while some think a person like me might have a “feel good about myself” mentality, I wonder how many pastors cling to the Word and hate what they’re doing (and being highly ineffective while doing it).

BeHim responds:
Are you sure they are ineffective while they cling to the Word of God? By what standard do you measure their effectiveness?

If we measure in human terms, yes, they might be highly ineffective and even inefficient.

But God’s eyes are crystal clear: I’m sure the many examples we see in the Bible of men who “cling to the Word” are highly effective in what God is doing for the Kingdom (unless what you are saying is that they ‘hate’ a sin they are in - which is AMEN, a good thing, to “hate sin").

Clinging to the Word is a good thing ladies and gentlemen. Should we cling to effectiveness or efficiency?

We all want to be the best servants we can be but that is measured in Knowing and Understanding Him. For this reason, I exhort all Christians who read these books also read the secular versions, Dr. Phil, Robert Kiosaki, Tony Robbins and even Donald Trump. So you get a clear view of the counterfeit ideology that is “flowing” into the Christian’s frame of mind. These books all clearly follow a humanistic approach to solving problems and issues. A prime example of a christian author following this pattern is Joel Olsteen’s “New York Times Best Seller”.

Why get a clear view about this? Because the Anti-Christ (the counterfeit) will not come rallying behind Satanism, we would all recognize that. He won’t come rallying behind humanism either, again, I say no! He will come rallying behind the banner of UNITY. Humanism blurs ideas and beliefs so we can unify behind one common cause, US (and that isn’t in reference to a country).
Posted by Todd Rhoades

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 7:34 AM

BeHim,

My only response is that while you question my ability to assertain an individual’s effectiveness in any case, YOU are able to somehow read my mind and motives and find them to be unbiblical and humanistic.

One question… do you really think that I am part of the humanistic, counterfeit, Anti-Christ? If so, why are you here?

Todd
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 9:23 AM

Thank You Todd and Bernie for elaborating on what I was trying to say the first time I commented on the topic. It’s a balance of surrender and identifying your strengths and weaknesses God has given you for His service. The more we desire to understand ourselves the better we can know why God chose us to do the task we are doing right now. However, because God is in the equation He doesn’t always work as we expect. He knows what we can bear and who will become in this plan we call His will. We may never know why we have been through the things we have been through but we must trust Him with our lives and obey when He speaks to us. Even if it is unconventional. Thanks for the discussion. I was truly blessed.
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 9:49 AM

wow - i’m not nearly as smart as all of you - but that doesn’t mean i don’t have an opinion.
i think that since God made each one of us uniquely and that everyone has different strengths and areas of interest that it’s just possible that God placed those strengths and interests there to accomplish His will. for example, i am organized and i love, love, love the opportunity to help someone get organized. whether it’s physical or just helping organizing thoughts, i enjoy that. my neighbor doesn’t enjoy it at all. why would it not be safe to assume that God has given me that desire and therefore would ask me to use it to help others? i do agree that God will at times ask us to do things that stretch us, but even then i think we will find that there will be aspects of that task that will use my strengths...the strengths that God gave me. And that He gave my neighbor other strengths that she can use for God’s glory? to me it just makes sense. if you remember from where you get your strength - then everything is for God’s glory.
Posted by Todd Rhoades

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 10:00 AM

Thanks, Michelle… you may be smarter than all of us!

Todd
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 12:09 PM

TODD WRITES:
My only response is that while you question my ability to ascertain an individual’s effectiveness in any case, YOU are able to somehow read my mind and motives and find them to be unbiblical and humanistic.

BeHim responds:
Which of these fathers would you say loves the child?
A. The father that sees the young child stepping close to the bon-fire and if the wind shifts, the child would be consumed by the bon-fire and says or does nothing to or with the child

OR

B. The father that sees the young child stepping close to the bon-fire and if the wind shifts, the child would be consumed by the bon-fire and runs to the child to save him.

How am I wrong in encouraging Christians to watch out for the ideology of humanistic “christian” books? To test them with contrast and comparison or best yet, with Scripture!

This again is not about YOU Todd, it is about the ideology behind your statement and the book (and others like it). I cannot nor do I want to be the one who knows the minds (or hearts) of men, I simply want to encourage you and others to know the mind and heart of God and weigh the ideas behind these books and be able to test these ideas with Scripture, correctly discerning what is right and what is wrong.

TODD WRITES:
One question… do you really think that I am part of the humanistic, counterfeit, Anti-Christ? If so, why are you here?

BeHim responds:
Why such animosity Todd? Only you can truly test if you are or are not a part of the counterfeit, humanistic, Anti-Christ movement? Do you test your ideas (as well as others) and feelings with Scripture?

Would you rather I keep silent and allow the children of God to play by the fire? Are you encouraging me to leave and not say anything? That truly wouldn’t be Love, that would be hate and I don’t hate anybody, not even the guy that wrote the book but I do hate the idea behind it (just to tie into the “subject” matter).

Humanism has become a very real part of our society and the Christian must be aware of it so they can know how and when to identify it (counterfeit). Identifying humanism is not about semantics (the word I or Us) it is about the idea behind the words.

I encourage you Todd to test the “spirits” (ideas, thoughts, motives) of books.

May God Bless His People in Knowledge and Truth. Amen.
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 12:17 PM

TODD WRITES:
My only response is that while you question my ability to ascertain an individual’s effectiveness in any case, YOU are able to somehow read my mind and motives and find them to be unbiblical and humanistic.

Is the idea behind this statement humanistic?
[Bottom line… I want my life to make a difference in the Kingdom… and yes, I’d like to feel good while doing it. Ministry is a blast when you’re plugged into the right spot… or as this author would say “doing what you love and not what you hate”.]

Test the statement with this: Is the statement serving the King of the Kingdom or the servant?

It’s like the servant saying:
I will make a difference for the Kingdom
I will feel good while making a difference for the Kingdom
The making a difference will be a blast for me as long as I’m doing what I want/love

Who or what does that sound like in Scripture? That’s why the idea is so dangerous!

It is NOT about what we love but rather WHO we love.

Jesus Knows our “humanistic” tendencies when He says… “Love others as you love ….”

“In the end days, men will be lovers of ……”

The WHO we love should always overcome the “what” we love.
Posted by Todd Rhoades

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 1:00 PM

BeHim,

No animosity here… if you weren’t saying that “I” was humanistic, you, at least were saying that I was promoting it by the inclusion of this article (which to me would be about the same thing).

That’s the problem with blogs… you don’t know me or my heart. If you did, you’d know you were really off-target.

You said, “I simply want to encourage you and others to know the mind and heart of God"… that’s great, cause that’s my goal here as well. I hope to do so through encouragement, and, yes, aligning people with God’s Word.

Again, just because we strive to use our strengths for Kingdom use doesn’t mean that we are humanistic.

Anyone else have any input?

Todd
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 2:23 PM

Todd, the real point is that you recognize when your ideas, thoughts and opinions are or appear to be humanistic and I think we’ve covered that well.

As for knowing you, I know you have this ministry (the blog) and the ChurchStaffing.com ministry and although we may differ in opinions and maybe even non-essential doctrines, I’m glad to know you’re encouraging people to speak up and discuss issues, concerns and ideas, to His Glory.

It’s not about being on or off target about you or him or her, it’s about me being on target Biblically and hopefully to His FULL Glory.

Again, it isn’t about you and your strengths, remember that I encourage you to test the idea behind that kind of statement, it’s about Him and how He will use your strengths and even your weaknesses (which is where HE is strongest) to His Glory now and in the Kingdom of Heaven.

It isn’t about service, it IS about obedience. Jesus could raise stones to serve Him, it’s ALL about the willing obedience to Him (strengths, will, weaknesses, everything).

Anyone else have any input?
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 3:58 PM

Okay, bonfires.
What if the “fire” were the Holy Spirit and a deeper relationship with God? (As is often used in scripture.) The children are drawn by it’s the light & warmth. It’s beauty and power. Perhaps even the danger? In this scenario, it might be GOOD that they are touched by the flames. I’d like to see the “fire” spread across this nation.
But, in many of your responses, you are coming across as though if this “fire” does not match YOUR standard of righteousness, you would beat it cold and hurry the “children” of into the cold darkness of self-righteousness and obedient religiosity. Would you keep them warm with sack cloth, ashes and to beat off the chill, the occasional flogging? Would you have them build their fires small, correct and controlled with the proper size and shaped lumps of coal that you supply?

Yes, my response is extreme but many of the responses have been more than a little overboard! Like using a bazooka to deal with a gnat.
Humanism? Jesus often communicated in very humanisic terms to teach the people and disciples. I think that’s all Todd (the article he presented) was/is doing. On that point, who most often spoke in terms of obedience, rules and laws? Pharisee’s. As I see it, the problem Jesus had with the Pharisee’s wasn’t misinterpretation but their self-rigtheousness, hypocracy and the use of The Law to oppress people.
I stay in the ministry not because of fear nor of obedience. I stay because I would be less that what I am called to be. IT’S MY PURPOSE! (haha) I would like to do something else that’s easier, FUNNER, pays more but,regardless of love or hate, good or bad, easy or difficult, I’m called to serve Him. And I know, that no matter what, He’s gonna love me. From where you stand, where is grace, mercy and faith? 1 Corinthians 13?, 1st & 2nd John? I would rather have Jesus in the humanistic terms of Friend, Brother, Lover, King, Lord and Savior than feeling as though my place was primarily crouched before the throne in subtle oppression, naked obediance and humble self-rigtheousness. HE is and, I believe, offers and desires so much more than that of us
Ben E.
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 4:41 PM

Todd said:

“That’s the problem with blogs… you don’t know me or my heart. If you did, you’d know you were really off-target.”

True, Todd, that we may not “know” you or your heart through a blog, I believe we can ascertain through the general trend of the topics that you seem to adore posting, that you are a very business-minded person who views most things through a consumeristic worldview.

By that I mean that you appear to be attracted to virtually any new fad or gimmick that “churches” are using that fills the pews, including the “it’s all about me” foundation of humanistic thought.

Just an observation, though.
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 5:46 PM

Ben.

If I have offended you in some way, forgive me. The discussion obviously has been a burden on you.

Take note, I’m not being extreme, I’m simply pointing out the dangers of humanism in christian thought and it is obvious humanism has become mainstream in Christianity.

Why do you conclude I hate you? Because I point out obedience to God is the real reason we are here? If you’re not (or I am not) called to be obedient, what are you/we called to? Service? By what standard? Do you consider obedience to be a bad thing? Again, by what standard?

You assume I don’t love my bretheren but I would hope my bon-fire example reveals my intent. My intent is to draw contrast to an idea that is against the Word of God. I shouldn’t keep quiet because some who hear might grow hard and angry, should I? That wouldn’t be love, would it?

Humanism is NOT of the Holy Spirit and Jesus’ teaching were not humanistic (building man up) His teachings always taught of obedience and submission, carrying the cross and the like, to the Father.

I would rather not lay into you as you have done to me. I’m sorry you feel service is more important than obedience but I’ll simply disagree with you.

Again, I’m sorry if for whatever reason you are offended but please, forgive me.
Posted by

Tuesday, May 10, 2005 at 5:53 PM

But Rick,
Each time ANYTHING is presented for discussion that remotely suggests something outside the orthodoxy in which you and others seem to live in, we know the topic will never stay on track. Remember the article of the Pastor, the burritos (sp?) and the penny? It took less than three entries before some had him judged as trite, petty and spiritually shallow when all he did was relate a small but teachable moment. Hummm...almost like a mustard seed, a fig tree, a splinter or a meager lunch before thousands of hungry people. Almost like that.
I can count on it. “The usual suspects” will come tearing in and bludgeon the topic with the predictable labels of “consumerism, humanism, heresy, fad, gimmick, growth, programs” and so on and so forth. “How dare you have fun in ministry when, if you truly loved Jesus, you’d be bleeding from your eyes!” I’m sorry, but the responses mainly come off as smug, self-righteous, spiritually legalistic religiosity! (There’s some labels none of us want.)
I don’t think that is what you intend BUT, if I judge by the “general trend” in the way ya’ll “adore” pouncing on these subjects, perhaps someone could judge you to be what your responses seem to project...hummmm?

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Hi... I'm Todd Rhoades. I'm a Christ-follower, husband, father and I love to connect leaders with other leaders. Hopefully you'll find something here at MMI you like and will return often. If you want, you can find out more about me or follow my every step on Twitter.