Fishon,

I would say that they can teach Christians a lot. Wendi pointed out one way. I would say that Ghandi puts many Christians to shame in the way his compassionate concern for the hurting and broken moved him to action.

The truth is, we can learn from anyone...if we want to. I would feel honored to meet the Dalai Lama or Desmond Tutu. That doesn’t mean I have to agree with their spiritual beliefs.

I think this is an interesting post.  I believe my calling is to preach the Gospel.  This is a venue I could not fulfill that calling.  I believe that the danger in talking to kids about spirituality right alongside of Hinduism, Buddhism and such is that there is a romantic love affair we have with these religions in the west.  This love affair in contrast to the derision Christianity faces makes talking about being spiritual pointless. 

When you travel to these other countries where these religions are the majority and smell the death they bring, that love affair goes away.  If these guys wish to do this, I don’t care but the question was would you do it if you were asked… No, I most likely would not.  Not my venue, not my calling.

Wendi:

“I get really bothered by the expectation (CS) that a Christian must take over any forum into which he/she has been invited, use the time to condemn the sin of every non-believer present and point out every falsehood they become aware of . . . or else they’ve somehow sold out. “

Go back an reread what I posted.  I presented a what-if, and did not say that the people there would have to address everything to be true to the Gospel.

What I did say was that in this particular forum, I doubt that some aspects of our faith would be tolerated if brought up.  Things like sin, righteousness, and Jesus Christ being the only way to God would likely be frowned upon as being “narrow-minded.” This makes it unequally yoked.

Suppose, for instance, that the Dalai Lama states that everyone is there because we all have different ways to get to the same eternal outcome.  If I, as a Christian, do not respond to this, my silence could be perceived as tacit compliance.  So, I say, “Although you are a great guy Tenzin, no, you are wrong here.” Think that would fly?

So, if we are not allowed to speak about any aspect of our faith without liberty, while others may make broad statements that may step onto our faith, yes, that constitutes being unequally yoked.  Besides that, read the rest of the verses I cited in 2 Corinthians 6.  It’s not just about the yoking, its about having fellowship with things untoward our faith.

--
CS

Wendi,
I didn’t figure out the religion of my childrens teachers, nor did I go looking into their religion. I never did remove my children from a teacher’s influence. However, if it would have come to my attention that there might be a conflict....

You said: My sister-in-law is Buddhist.  Her religion teaches selflessness and concern for others.
------I don’t doubt you. But Christianity/Bible teaches that, and Jesus is the great model. And don’t you know any Christians that model the same thing as your sister-in-law?
But I chase us in circles!

fishon

Eric,
Yes, Ghandi did put some Christians to shame. But it wasn’t because he knew something because of his religion that Christianity did not teach. His religion did not offer or teach in a superior way anything as opposed to Christianity.

Yes, there is something we can learn from most anyone; however, in the realm of religion, why do we have to go, even encourage some to go and learn from say, the lama. For the lama has NOTHING new or unique to teach a Christian that the Bible does NOT teach or some of our great Christian teachers. WHAT MIGHT THAT BE, if you disagree with that statement?

The lama teaches things against God/Jesus just like the teachers of Baal did. Would you be honored to meet with the priest of Baal? Would you be honored to meet with the apostles of the Mormon church???

If you would NOT be honored to meet with the old prophets of Baal, but the lama, tell me the difference. Both practice[d] false religion.

I look forward to reading your reply.
fishon

Leonard,
You said it very well. Several of our illustrious leaders and politicans seem to have a “love affair” with Hinduism and Buddhism, and the lama. Why? They are being fooled by the “masquerading angel of light.”

Plain and simple--the lama is a FALSE religion teacher. DOES ANYONE HERE ON THIS BLOG DISAGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT? Or do you not to not even touch that?
fishon

Leonard,

Yeah I see where you are coming from. Even if an evangelical Christian was given liberty to speak as a Christian, there would be the subtle pressure to go along with the homogenization agenda of the organizers.

For me, I think it would be an awesome opportunity for the gospel. It would certainly be subversive, but isn’t gospel preaching always subversive? I guess if some one comes to me and says, “I am screwed up and I would Jesus to help me.” Then my preaching of the gospel to them wouldn’t really be subverting their intentions.

But outside of those rare encounters, isn’t most gospel preaching subversive? People have their own agenda and they come to Christ trying to meet some need for inner peace, fulfillment, satisfaction, happiness, the removal of guilt, etc. Their agenda is set, but the preaching of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus undermines that and reorients truth around God’s desires and purposes.

It would subvert their agenda, but doesn’t the gospel answer spiritual questions and teach children compassion?

Derek

Allow me to respond to fishon’s statement and question, “the lama is a FALSE religion teacher. DOES ANYONE HERE ON THIS BLOG DISAGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT? “ I think I can safely say that no one on this blog would disagree with that statement. 

Perhaps the more important question - or at least the more difficult one - is precisely what the direction Todd was going when he opened this discussion: What if you (Christian) were invited to speak at an event with a teacher of a false religion?  How would you handle that?  I don’t think there is a “right” answer (though judging from some of the previous comments, I may need to roll up my sleeves so they don’t get messed up when I’m crucified!).  At one point in his ministry, Jesus said to be wise as a serpent and gentle as a dove; that’s probably pretty sound counsel for this discussion.  Or how about, speak the truth in love. 

Are we afraid that the advancement of the kingdom of God will be thwarted if Rob Bell and Doug Pagitt actually share the stage with a false teacher?  I’m not.  Will the advance of the kingdom be enhanced?  I don’t know - but it won’t be thwarted...unless perhaps by those on “our side” who will throw stones at their brothers on the stage.

Fishon, in all gentleness, I want to say that I think the best conclusion you’ve drawn is this:  “Man, I had better just let this go.” The invitation is obviously not something you would accept, nor do you think it is right for any other believer to accept it.  That’s fine, and I certainly don’t fault you for your conviction.  But it’s also obvious that there are many others with a different opinion, which suggests to me that there really may not be a “right” or “wrong” answer to Todd’s questions.

Derek,
I am sucked back in. Randy, I just can’t help my self.

YOU: Is it really a biblical problem or is it a religious/cultural problem?  I mean, have we too narrowly defined our idea of preaching the gospel to the point that we need a building, a big pulpit, and a room full of Christians in order to preach the gospel?
-------I won’t rehash some of what I have perviously said, but will answer this way; I would almost be inclined to be there if it was a debate about religions. But that is not the emphasis of the conference. Much of it is about the future of Children, and the other is about the lama. Read some of the info. It is all about lama. I dare say if you ask a Seattleite what religion the conference is about, they will say---------, you fill in the blank.

YOU: Does preaching the truth of the gospel mean that we must aways point out the falsity of other religions?
-----Certainly if they are setting at the same table and arguing for their religion.

YOU: What is wrong with lovingly and truthfully proclaiming the life, death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus without adding...oh yeah you are wrong and we are right?
-----Nothing if you are alone with the person. And you know, Stephen would might have lived a long time if he hadn’t told those folks they were wrong. Stephen did say “You stiff-necked people with uncircumcised hearts....” He missed the notice that you shouldn’t tell them they are wrong. And, my goodness, do you really think Paul suffered so much because he didn’t convey that those he was preaching to were wrong in their religious assessments? Why do you think he was beaten, stoned, left for dead?

YOU: Jesus was ruthless in handing out judgment to his fellow Jews, but did he building his ministry around condemning the pagans?
-----No, Jesus handed out judgment on those who didn’t represent who he was correctly. He did not hand out judgment to ALL his fellow jews.

YOU: Elijah had his showdown on Mt. Carmel with the prophets of Baal, but again he wasn’t trying to disprove the reality of Baal, but to show the superiority of the LORD over all other Gods. He did mock them and their god, which I find funny, but was he purpose to condemn them or to proclaim the truth of the living God?
------Why of course he was trying to disprove the reality of Baal. And he did it by proving the superiority of God. You bet his purpose was to condemn them. What else would you call him killing all those prophets. If they could speak, they would cry, “Why are you condemning us, to death?”

YOU: Does joining the platform with other religious leaders really constitute an endorsement of their views? This is really a matter of conscience. If your conscience would convict you then I can respect that, but I would ask, is your conscience shaped by Scripture or by a religious sub-culture of a narrowly defined view of preaching?
-----Derek, the whole conference is based around who????? Who, pray tell, is getting TOP billing? Who are the majority of people going to listen to? Who’s picture adorns the advertizing? In this case, being on the platform with lama endorses him and his religion to the vast majority who will attend, and to those that the Buddhists will point to as part of THEIR conference.
-----My conscience is shaped by “Scripture.” If Stephen had decided to set down with Saul and have a conference, gee, he might have lived a long life. If the apostles had conferenced instead of making someone mad, they would have died old and natural deaths. But you know what? They ticked somebody off for not being politically correct.
And things like what Jesus told the Church at Pergamum give me my view of the matter.

YOU: Me thinks thou dost protest too much..

What thinkest thou?
-----I don’t know? You did respond, so maybe not.
By the way, I do NOT call for a stoning of you because I think you wrong. Heck, I would have stoned myself to death a long time ago if wrong got people stoned.
MAKE IT a great tomorrow.
fishon

If the purpose is to “help kids find spiritual answers and compassion” who better to do that than those who have truth?

So, we let the Dali Lama do his stuff without any rebuttal?  I think taking the opportunity to present the truth would be the right thing to do as long as you had the freedom to say what you wanted and didn’t water down taht truth.

I have to say I had many many interesting conversations with people who went to see the Dali Lama and came away dissulisioned because he had nothing to say.

But a lot of Christians refused to take those sharing opportunities, because they were afraid of being perceived as antagonists, or as supporters.  Out of the 8 evangelical churches in our community, only 2 would even prayer walk (one was our church).

It shocked me how few pastors were willing to stand up and be counted for Christianity.

So, I unfortunately read these posts with a bit of skeptism.  How many of the pastors represented here, are just afraid to stand up with the Dali Lama and proclaim truth?  (not accusing anyone, just wondering) There are a lot of pastors who in the name of peace just prefer to blend in and let him pass through and do his stuff.

This man is leading thousands of people astray.  When are we going to be willing to stand up against him and what he says?

And how can we possibly criticize those who are willing to do so.  I think it’s appalling that some will actually say that these pastors are lumped in with the Dali Lama because they’ve accepted the invitation.

fishon,

Thanks for the responses. I think I see where you are coming from and I guess we simply view preaching and evangelism differently. Not that there is anything wrong with that. Your points are well taken, but my major point of disagreement would be that not all gospel preaching needs to be polemical; it doesn’t always have to be a debate; we don’t always have to argue (imho).

Persecution certainly is a part of gospel preaching. If we preach the truth we will be persecuted, but if we look at Acts for example, Stephen and Paul were stoned by the Jews not by the pagans. The Jews saw the early Christians as a radical sect of Jews following a slain Jewish teacher. The Jews stoned them (Stephen & Paul) as their own. Paul and the early church (much like Jesus) saved their challenge and fight for the Jews, they seemed to be much more patient with the pagans.

Certainly there is a time for debate, but it seems to me that there is also time for patience in proclaiming the gospel in a post-Christian, pluralistic culture.

Martyrdom is indeed a part of the faith and certainly shapes our view of evangelism. I have done some work training pastors in India. Dozens of Christians lost their lives last December in the State of Orissa. Radical Hindus, who think Christians are destroying India, ransacked and burned homes, chased hundreds into the woods, and killed some. The problem is some states in India have anti-conversion laws and these radical Hindus false accuse Christians of bribing or coercing Hindus to convert. They even claim is we give food or clothing to the Hindus that these are bribes! 

The strategy of the Indian Christians I work with is not polemical. I doubt they would ever get an invite to share the stage with His Holiness, but there evangelism strategy is quite peaceful. They tell the Hindus to make Jesus their guru, their religious master. They purposefully tell them not to convert or change their religion. Once they make Jesus their guru, the Christian leaders get them into Bible classes and then talk to them about the sin of idolatry. The key here is they wait until the Hindus are responsive to the Jesus, before pointing out the errors of Hinduism. This leads to a process of discipleship before the new believers are baptized.

I think we can learn from them. And yes, I do have a love affair with CHRISTIANS in the East!

We can learn from them because they live in a culture not dominated by a Christian worldview and we are living in a culture which is rapidly becoming less dominated by a Christian worldview. If our evangelism strategy is always caviler, always combative, if we bust into every man’s world with our gospel guns a blazin’, I fear we will become less effective in preaching the gospel.

Thanks for the dialog! You have really got me thinking on this one.

Derek

Jan,
YOU: And how can we possibly criticize those who are willing to do so.  I think it’s appalling that some will actually say that these pastors are lumped in with the Dali Lama because they’ve accepted the invitation.
-------Is there any record of Bell or Pagitt taking a stand at this ongoing conference against lama and his teaching? Or were they afraid of being perceived as antagonists? I would be very interested to know that.
-----And if they DID stand up for the cause of Christ, I would stand corrected and apologize.
fishon